So who won the drag race?
stingray719
TY 4 Stroke God
Thanks, was just wondering because engagement speed is important to me but not necessarily important to others. You clarified that for me.
"If you dont like what you read here then just dont comment......" just asking a question, not sure where this came from.
I just want to know the fastest setup so I can kick some butt tomorrow. Settings,rpm's and speeds please. I am not racing other Yamahas I want to kick some Cat and Doo butt.
tapex_07
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Nothing wrong with that lol
What you guys found is about what we found a couple weekends back. The tricky part is the "impression" as you stated. Would be nice to plot with a gun once and see what differences there in the acceleration curves.
Muffin
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Traction seamed very close between the two with straight line traction edging towards the ripsaw. I however prefer the cobra in the turns. Switching from the ripsaw to the cobra on the Viper is not nearly as dramatic as it was on the Nytro.
Turtle
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Tom's sled (2015 XTX) has the Excel intake and exhaust on it. COTC with that sled did have a very nice low engagement and the pull to top speed was very linear. Very very smooth setup. If I recall, top rpm was around 9200 with a top speed of about 97-98. Ulmer's kit had a higher engagement speed with a better low and mid range pull. Top speed was 100 with an rpm of 9300. But we all felt the best setup on this sled was Excel's kit. Low and mid range felt the best and it pulled 100mph right at 9000 rpm.
The two short tracks were both RTX SE models. One was a 2014 with a Cobra track and still using the 2014 map (no reflash on this sled). The other was a 2015 RTX SE with the Ripsaw 2. These sled both have Ulmer's clutch machining done on them and have his clutch kit and exhaust. We started out on both of these using the Ultimax XS805. Which when tweaked for that belt had a great low and mid range pull. And topped out at 100 with around 9000rpm. We then switched one sled to the 8DN belt just to see the difference - and WOW was a difference. We changed nothing on the clutch setup other than the belt. When switching to the 8DN, we could only get about 70mph out of it. Any more and it would overrev drastically. That told us the setup needs to be completely difference for the 8DN. So changed the 2014 model setup back to Ulmer's recommendations (as the kit comes setup from him) and bang - 100mph at 9000rpm with great low and mid range.
Drag race - Two RTX SEs ... one with Ulmer's recommended setup, 8DN and Cobra, the other with our tweaked Ulmer setup, XS805 and Ripsaw 2. Wouldn't you believe it .. the two were dead even from stop to top speed. They were both even from a roll-on start to top speed. If any sled had an edge, I'd say the Ripsaw had a bit better traction.
The vendors that offer their kits put a lot of time, effort and money in coming up with what they provide. What we found is that if you have mods other than the clutch kit (such as intake or exhaust), their clutch kit seems to work best with their mods. Example - Excel's clutching worked best with Excel's intake and exhaust. All of these kits can be made to run the way YOU want them to. Some extremely smooth, others have great mid range and low end. But ALL can be made to run 100mph. My only recommendation is use whatever kit you want. Use whatever Vendor or setup you like the best. In the end you will likely be happy.
The two short tracks were both RTX SE models. One was a 2014 with a Cobra track and still using the 2014 map (no reflash on this sled). The other was a 2015 RTX SE with the Ripsaw 2. These sled both have Ulmer's clutch machining done on them and have his clutch kit and exhaust. We started out on both of these using the Ultimax XS805. Which when tweaked for that belt had a great low and mid range pull. And topped out at 100 with around 9000rpm. We then switched one sled to the 8DN belt just to see the difference - and WOW was a difference. We changed nothing on the clutch setup other than the belt. When switching to the 8DN, we could only get about 70mph out of it. Any more and it would overrev drastically. That told us the setup needs to be completely difference for the 8DN. So changed the 2014 model setup back to Ulmer's recommendations (as the kit comes setup from him) and bang - 100mph at 9000rpm with great low and mid range.
Drag race - Two RTX SEs ... one with Ulmer's recommended setup, 8DN and Cobra, the other with our tweaked Ulmer setup, XS805 and Ripsaw 2. Wouldn't you believe it .. the two were dead even from stop to top speed. They were both even from a roll-on start to top speed. If any sled had an edge, I'd say the Ripsaw had a bit better traction.
The vendors that offer their kits put a lot of time, effort and money in coming up with what they provide. What we found is that if you have mods other than the clutch kit (such as intake or exhaust), their clutch kit seems to work best with their mods. Example - Excel's clutching worked best with Excel's intake and exhaust. All of these kits can be made to run the way YOU want them to. Some extremely smooth, others have great mid range and low end. But ALL can be made to run 100mph. My only recommendation is use whatever kit you want. Use whatever Vendor or setup you like the best. In the end you will likely be happy.
Muffin
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Remember the top speed of the machine therotically is governed by the mechanics of the sled. To gain top end the only thing you can do is improve clutching efficiency or increase RPM's.
A certain rpm turns the clutches (at about 90% to 95% effecency) which turns the chain (at a set ratio) which turns the drivers (at a set tooth pitch and diameter) which turns the track (at a set pitch).
The only variables are RPM's which you will eventually run out of and Clutching efficiency.
And of coarse snow conditions and the girth of the rider.
Clutching effiency means what primary and the secondary are doing at certain RPM's and the ratio between the them at certain RPM's. This is controlled by the belt compound, weights, weight curve, helix, and springs. I'm not an expert and only just staring to understand the relationship of the mechanics of clutching and achieving speed.
Remeber also that if you change any of the ratios like pitch or chain ratio for more top end you also need horsepower to get you there. And adding more and more horsepower (not that you can ever have too much power) may not increase top end, it will just get you to the mathematical top speed quicker.
There is no magic settings that are going to make your Viper go 110 mph. To go that fast you need more power, more RPM's, clutching, and maybe taller gearing and a lot more money to buy all that stuff.
This is the hard lesson that I had to learn about clutching, belts, speed and horsepower......
Sorry gang it's all about the math.
A certain rpm turns the clutches (at about 90% to 95% effecency) which turns the chain (at a set ratio) which turns the drivers (at a set tooth pitch and diameter) which turns the track (at a set pitch).
The only variables are RPM's which you will eventually run out of and Clutching efficiency.
And of coarse snow conditions and the girth of the rider.
Clutching effiency means what primary and the secondary are doing at certain RPM's and the ratio between the them at certain RPM's. This is controlled by the belt compound, weights, weight curve, helix, and springs. I'm not an expert and only just staring to understand the relationship of the mechanics of clutching and achieving speed.
Remeber also that if you change any of the ratios like pitch or chain ratio for more top end you also need horsepower to get you there. And adding more and more horsepower (not that you can ever have too much power) may not increase top end, it will just get you to the mathematical top speed quicker.
There is no magic settings that are going to make your Viper go 110 mph. To go that fast you need more power, more RPM's, clutching, and maybe taller gearing and a lot more money to buy all that stuff.
This is the hard lesson that I had to learn about clutching, belts, speed and horsepower......
Sorry gang it's all about the math.
Muffin
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As a side note.... I don't think I mentioned that I verified the speed on the speedometer with an onboard GPS. The speedo is very very accurate. It's was consistently within 1 mph of the GPS.
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Wish I could have been there with you guys instead of being sick......
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This was not a direct statement at you... it was just general statement to anyone ... It was a fun day and would like to do it again, just didnt want this to be a pissing match on clutch kits... this was only intended to pass alone some info we found...
Thanks for posting more info.
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I know Terry. I was hoping you could have made it. Lets see how the trails hold out over the next few weeks and maybe we can all meet up again and have some fun
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Your welcome, I bet as light as you are on the sleds that we tested you would be in the 106 range.... weight and how much you can get out of the wind is crucial in getting to those final top speed numbers.
BTW my XTX 1.6 cobra had better traction then the shortys.... but it should bigger lug and more track on the ground. All the sled are unstudded as well.
Nobody said if you won or not MrSled. Alot of work went into 106mph. Even more to 100mph. Glad you guys got it figured out in a day.
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