Water Skipping

[rxrider]

Yamaha's have 3 problems when it comes to water skipping.

First you have to silicone everywhere water can enter, in the tunnel, between the plastics and the frame, and in the front of the sled from the skis.

Second to make the Yamaha's work on water you need to use a shallow angled helix to keep the belt from slipping and bottoming in the secondary.

Third the skid needs to be set with at least stock transfer, and the limiter straps must be out at least to the stock setting to keep the skis to barely touch the water. One more thing, I have found better results on water running the suspension on the stiff side, with a lot more preload on the main shock and center shock springs to prevent the skid to be sucked in due to the high resistance from running on water.

I have been riding open water for a mile or more on my piped and ported 2001 SX700R. On that sled I ran a 43 straight Yamaha helix and a green secondary spring at 70 degrees, worked well. Speedo readings were 130 kmt or 80 MPH at the most.

On my '03 RX-1 when stock I only went 100+ meters or 300+ ft running on stock clutching, no problems encountered, but if I had been riding for a longer distance I would have run into trouble as the belt is slipping creating heat, this heat will make the belt slip eventually. When turboed I have ran about 500 meters or 1500 ft at the most, usually getting belt slippage.

The Predator tracks are great on water, IMO much better than the RipSaw.

Ski-Doo's are generally much better on water because of their clutches. Doo clutches are wound much harder than on the Yamaha's and Doo clutches does not slip the belt nearly as much as on a stock Yammy clutch.

But the Yamaha's can be made to run very well on water with the proper sealing, skid setup, clutching changes and a good track.

 

[Yamahammer485]

Yamaha's have 3 problems when it comes to water skipping.

First you have to silicone everywhere water can enter, in the tunnel, between the plastics and the frame, and in the front of the sled from the skis.

Second to make the Yamaha's work on water you need to use a shallow angled helix to keep the belt from slipping and bottoming in the secondary.

Third the skid needs to be set with at least stock transfer, and the limiter straps must be out at least to the stock setting to keep the skis to barely touch the water. One more thing, I have found better results on water running the suspension on the stiff side, with a lot more preload on the main shock and center shock springs to prevent the skid to be sucked in due to the high resistance from running on water.

I have been riding open water for a mile or more on my piped and ported 2001 SX700R. On that sled I ran a 43 straight Yamaha helix and a green secondary spring at 70 degrees, worked well.

On my '03 RX-1 I have only went 100+ meters or 300+ ft running on stock clutching, no problems encountered, but if I had been riding for a longer distance I would have run into trouble as the belt is slipping creating heat, this heat will make the belt slip eventually.

The Predator tracks are great on water, IMO much better than the RipSaw.

Ski-Doo's are generally much better on water because of their clutches. Doo clutches are wound much harder than on the Yamaha's and Doo clutches does not slip the belt nearly as much as on a stock Yammy clutch.

But the Yamaha's can be made to run very well on water with the proper sealing, skid setup, clutching changes and a good track.

Let me just say that it is great to see all that info there!

When you speak of belt slipping, is this only when the water gets on it, or just from the load on the clutches that running water makes?

 

[rxrider]

My experience running the turbo sled on water is that I can't give it full throttle, the clutches shifts out and when the belt is close to the bottom of the secondary it slips the belt badly, but that's to be expected cause I run a 54/48 helix. I have always been able to recover from this situations by letting off some throttle to let the clutches backshift and then add a little more to keep it afloat. In my turbo sled I can tell it has been slipping in the secondary from the black marks down in the bottom of the secondary, a straight 43 or 45 helix should work wonders, or even the 51/43 for shorter distances. But If you get water on the clutch faces it's usually game over in matter of seconds.

Bottom line, I have to say belt slipping is usually from the load on the clutches when water skipping, provided you have covered up all holes where water can enter the clutches.

Water is the hardest work you will ever put on your clutches other than launching at a dragrace with hardly no track slipping, but running on water the load on the belt is very high during the complete water run. The belt slipping usually occures after several hundred feets or more than hundred meters running the wrong clutch combo.

 

[sledheadgeorge]

My experience running the turbo sled on water is that I can't give it full throttle, the clutches shifts out and when the belt is close to the bottom of the secondary it slips the belt badly, but that's to be expected cause I run a 54/48 helix. I have always been able to recover from this situations by letting off some throttle to let the clutches backshift and then add a little more to keep it afloat. In my turbo sled I can tell it has been slipping in the secondary from the black marks down in the bottom of the secondary, a straight 43 or 45 helix should work wonders, or even the 51/43 for shorter distances. But If you get water on the clutch faces it's usually game over in matter of seconds.

Bottom line, I have to say belt slipping is usually from the load on the clutches when water skipping, provided you have covered up all holes where water can enter the clutches.

Water is the hardest work you will ever put on your clutches other than launching at a dragrace with hardly no track slipping, but running on water the load on the belt is very high during the complete water run. The belt slipping usually occures after several hundred feets or more than hundred meters running the wrong clutch combo.

My turbo starts to pull side ways when running water. Very finicky. I don't know if its from the long track but I have to hit water at lower speed and give it a little thumb at a time.

 

[rxrider]

I run a 136x15x1.25 ripsaw track under it, my friend have the same sled running a ripsaw 136x15x1.5 track, he tells me his sled is doing the same as yours. He runs the same helix and secondary spring as me, and runs into trouble (beltslipping) after 100-150 meters or 300-450 ft on water, but his sled spins out sideways sometimes. My sled have never done this.

What track length are you running?

 

[sledheadgeorge]

Must be the track then because I run the preditor 6 pitch. Never noticed this with the ripsaw first year I had the turbo.

 

[obr]

the Nytro isn't too great on water either...the Ripshit track sucks for almost evry condition except hardpack, so that's the FIRST thing to change before hitting the water...And...the running boards...I was wet to my NECK after playing around in these conditions... When you hit the water (slush, but still water) your rear suspension sinks like a submarine, and it doesn't get back up no matter what (atleast with a 230+lbs rider like me on), so water starts SLPASHING up through the running boards...My friend ducktaped his running boards to prevent this...

But...the Nytro was REALLY easy to turn on water...So with a different track and ducktaped runningboards, it might just be good for playing around... I seemed to loose ALOT of rpm's when I went out into the water(slush) but this also happens in deep snow.... So..maybe gear it down a tooth too...

 

[rxrider]

Hi there buddy

How was your trip to Riksen?

Too steep helix will pull down rpms on water, try a shallow angled straight helix like 43-45 degrees. Adjust spring pressure tight enough so it doesn't drop rpms when hitting water or whatever.

I have run the Predator tracks on water with success, they seem to gain track speed better than the ripsaw, both in snow and water.

 

[bigdog1000]

RXRIDER!!! Sounds like great info. Many thanks for the input. By the way, for people not keen on the Ripsaw...on my 800 Renegade with a 1 1/4 Ripsaw I could drop into the water at 5 km per hour, lay on the throttle and pull a water wheelie and rocket off like crazy across the water. I could slow down and speed up at will both in a straight line and in turns. Maybe it's performance depends on which machine the track is being used.
For sure my water playing days are over on this Apex..never been swimming in the Winter and do not want to start.

 

[rxrider]

HAHAHA me neither, I have retired my water skipping career, don't wanna sink the 4strokes, sunk them 2strokers a lot way back but I learned how to clutch them for water, at last, after a lot of swimming that is LOL

 

[nate007]

Sunk my Apex Father's day weekend riding on some flood water. Belt got wet, sled went into about 3 1/2 feet of water. After about 45 minutes of dinking around with it, I rode it back to the truck and all is fine with it. It was only in the water for about minutes though... I can't complain, my buddy sunk his 1000 'Gade before I sunk mine..
My sled has been torn down since, but other than changing fluids, nothing happened to mine.

 

[GotJuice]

We do a lot of skipping here in our valley, several rivers to cross and run up for miles to get to remote places to play. I've sunk mine a few times but only once bad in about 4ft. of water. Had to swim to the bank and crawl out. Was swift and cold, about zero farenheit that day. It was my fault was doing figure eights and got caulky, slipped on the running board and that was all she wrote, had to walk about 1/2 mile through knee deep powder to the highway and hitch a ride home a few miles. NOT FUN! have pictures but can't get to post...gives me an error?

 

[rxrider]

I've quit waterskipping on rivers and lakes, too dangerous for an old man with wife and kids.

 

[nate007]

We were pretty chicken about where we rode. With the floods we had this year, we actually rode about a mile on a flooded highway that was a consistant 8" deep. It was a blast! We could stop on the shoulder, the sled would sink until the running boards would touch, and then take off again. We started crossing a ditch into a flooded yard that was an easy shot out of the water. We kept running across the yard, through the flooded road ditch and onto the flooded highway. Pretty safe for my standards, since the deepest water was only about 4 foot at the bottom of the ditch. We rode for about 2 hours before I got my belt wet and lost it.. Nick had to slow down to miss a sign pole adn lost his 'Gade in the ditch too. Both were running again within 20 minutes or so with no damage other than a wet seat!!

 

[rxrider]

Waterskipping in the streets sounds like a blast and would be pretty safe too we never have such conditions around here, sounds like fun (not the flooding, but riding that is).

nate007 - Do you have any pics?