what I think should be in the 2014 apex

[SledFreak]

It can't be so front heavy . 4 stroke motors needs to be slammed down into the chassis. Reduce the high center of gravity and pull the motor as far back as possible. Remove the Rear exit exhaust. Put the battery in the rear to help offset the weight.

While I wouldn't mind seeing the sled lighter overall, I agree with exactly 50% of what you said. Slamming it down in the chassis to get a lower center of gravity is a GREAT idea. (Although I never have the ski lift / tippy issues that I did riding Polaris). However, moving the sleds weight back would be terrible. The Apex is a TRAIL SLED. If you dont have weight to transfer to the outside carbide, you will not be able to rail through corners. Having weight moved to the back end of the sled would create a lighter front end and then when you pound the throttle in the apex of the corner, your front end will lift up. Hell, most of the aggressive riders would tell you that they are torquing down their limiter strap to get more pressure on their skis. Moving weight back would do the opposite.

Correct me if I am wrong, but Skidoo did not move the engine back. They moved the rider forward, over the engine. The rider moving forward actually gets more weight on the skis.

I can see from your avatar that you are not riding an Apex and that your skis are off the ground. I can imagine the smile on your face under that helmet! An Apex can wheelie like mad if you loosen out the limiter strap, soften the back suspension to low and move back on the seat. Cadillac low rider style and your front end wont touch the ground. (Just makes cornering a BITCH)

I owned an Apex for 4 years. I know how they handle. The Nytro is not as good in the trail as a Apex. I not really saying to move everything to the back, just some things to help offset the heavy motor. Doo moved the motor back and the driver forward to get centraization. More of a pivoting/rotating axis... They just looked at it from the ATV world and tried to centrailize it all. Motor and driver..

 

[sheetwright]

Which makes since for the reason that the cross country team, Skinz, and Z-bros heading in the direction of moving the Nytro front end 3" forward, and down a couple. Also the team and guys adding a relocating kit for a 128" track that is slightly lower. All these changes kind of match the rumor mill to give us a sled that can handle th ebumps and turns like a Nytro but be more stable like a centralized sled position like the cross country sled layout. Flickable like a 128", but the length of a 136" with the relocated front end, and a lower rider forward stance which makes the sled feel lower like an apex or vector, but ergo's of the Nytro. All rumors of course, but a lot of them

 

[Sasquatch]

I see no need for an Apex if they increase the horse power of the Nytro. If you could have a new entry sled to replace the phazer, the vector with some Nytro torque, and Nytro with about 180HP why do you need a heavy 150hp Apex. Especially if there is the potential for the race front end on the nytro style. That would give it a 136" stance on a 121" track making it feel flatter and still eating the bumps. If anything make the Vector about 135-140HP, the new entry at 120-125hp, and the Nytro at 180, and you have something. Just my .02......

Especially if Yamaha is really going to switch it up.We need to see a vmax4, srx 700, or a RX1 shake up in the world again IMO

Do not want the Nytro, do not want the three cylinder. The 4 cylinder motor is near the same weight as the 3 and gives that super bike sound. The Apex is a better groomed trail lake racer sled compaired to the Nytro.

No don't ruin a good thing leave the Apex alone. Plus getting 180 hp out of the Apex is next to impossible with out boost Getting it out of a Nytro? Maybe if you punsh it out to about 15 or 1600cc

 

[Super Sled]

I completely agree Sasquatch, but I think the writing is on the wall.

Expect done sort of detuned 3 cylinder motor with option for boost to 180 ish hp

 

[Sasquatch]

I completely agree Sasquatch, but I think the writing is on the wall.

Expect done sort of detuned 3 cylinder motor with option for boost to 180 ish hp

Hate to say this but if Yami drops the 4 banger, why ride Blue? Might as well buy a Doo for 3 grand less! Although a 3 banger turbo will sound a bit better then a twin turbo. Still its all about the motor and the Apex has it. I live for that snarl! Better get my Apex soon then!

 

[sheetwright]

Don't think this would happen but it would be cool IMO to make the apex engine in a low lake racer type like what cat did with their old 1000, and make the higher HP cross country stance for their sno pro version. I hear though it comes down to cost. The apex is very expensive to make. I believe it is a great motor and no one has one better but it needs to be in a cost effective to manufacturer sled. yamaha makes such bullet proof stuff we have no reason to buy often. So the only way to make a die hard blue fan buy is to change technology drastically. Otherwise with a sled that can go 30,000 miles is there a reason for the average joe to drop 10-13k on improvements like air ride and power steering? I loved my apex and we love them so much we don't buy more and the lack of technology changes, doesn't make yellow, red, or green fans switch to mighty blue easily. Game changes do. Sad but true

 

[Murse]

Alright, I give up! You guys are right, heavier is better! I just joined the gym cause I'm just weak! The magazines are wrong, the other three manufactures are wrong, lightweight sleds are a conspiracy theory right up there with UFOs at Area 51 and the US was responsible for the attacks on 9/11! lol. I say get rid of the titanium chaincase cover and headers, use heavier materials the sled will handle better and not bounce around the trail! Yamaha should save the money and just pump up the HP on the Apex and call it good. Honestly, I do love my Attak as is but I will try and add some weight to make it better! Can't wait for the snow!

This post is just for fun! Don't take it personally! Life is short, laugh a lot!

Don't forget a HUGE iron board wing and fart can's plus stickers add extra Horsepower!

 

[Sled Dog]

I can think of two things that is very doable to lessen weight without changing a whole lot. #1 build a clutch that will take the 12000 rpm and get rid of gear reduction altogether. #2 go with a belt drive instead of gear and chain.

 

[miner]

only 2 & 3 cylinder engines including a H.O. Super Charged version that will make the heavy 4 Cylinder unnecessary.

No factory machine will fit the conditions and favored riding position of every rider, and as a result I have seen the front and rear suspensions changed out, the seat, bodywork, tunnel, clutches, skis, track, handlebars and controls, exhaust, and every part but the engine. There are countless conversions where other sleds have been improved with the addition of the four cylinder engine because of its power, durability and dimensions with the ability to reliably double the power output with a turbo. No one who advocates getting rid of this engine has suggested something better. A better engine will come along but not yet. The four cylinder engine is the Apex, all the other parts are negotiable and just along for the ride.

 

[cannondale27]

I did.A Boxer engine.Flat 4.Lower center of gravity.Cripes I was looking at a WRX Subaru other day and it looked like even its engine would fit in a Apex!

 

[Sasquatch]

only 2 & 3 cylinder engines including a H.O. Super Charged version that will make the heavy 4 Cylinder unnecessary.

No factory machine will fit the conditions and favored riding position of every rider, and as a result I have seen the front and rear suspensions changed out, the seat, bodywork, tunnel, clutches, skis, track, handlebars and controls, exhaust, and every part but the engine. There are countless conversions where other sleds have been improved with the addition of the four cylinder engine because of its power, durability and dimensions with the ability to reliably double the power output with a turbo. No one who advocates getting rid of this engine has suggested something better. A better engine will come along but not yet. The four cylinder engine is the Apex, all the other parts are negotiable and just along for the ride.

I agree the Apex motor is the sled! Kill the motor kill the Apex! Besides why does everyone seem to think that the 4 cylinder is heavier then the 3. Seem to me not long ago it was posted that the there was only a few pounds difference.

If you look at the two motors dimensionally they are near the same. If a Apex motor will fit in a Nytro frame then the four can't be that much larger as Yami basiclly shrink wrapped the body and frame around the motors.

And to those who think that turning the motor around and putting the muffler up front and the battery in the rear will make the sled less front heavy, think about it the muffler system weighs a way more then the battery. The exaugst goes out the back to better balance the sled. The motor sits low in the chassis and tipped back to get the weight as low as it can be.

A boxer motor will lower the height of the motor but move more weight forward over the skis. It will be narrower but will it be any lighter. As yami does not have a boxer motor I'm aware of i don't think that will happen. A cross plane four cylinder is an option but like the R1 Apex engine it can not and will not be a motor cycle engine anymore. It will have roots based on the bike engine but it is a new design.

Anyone buying into the magazines retoric about the Apex being an motorcycle engine not a Sled engine as if that is a bad thing is being fooled! The Apex or R1 engine has been redesigned and refined over time to work in the sled environment and work very well. 2003 to 2013 and still has loyal following says a lot. Seems Mags want new engines every few years if they do not see that then they think something is getting long in the tooth! Even they can not point out any faults in the engine.

The crossplane engine does not seem to have any major improvements that will benifit a snowmobile engine that anyone has pointed out yet. So is it just hoping for change for changes sake! My Dad always said if its not broken don't fix it! The Apex is not broken! Its the most refined sled in the lineup!

It seems like a lot of people want the Apex power in a Nytro chassis. I myself want the Apex motor in the Venture trim which is the same chassis. Not going to happen it seems and its a very easy thing to do all it needs is longer pipes. Last thing however I want is a Nytro! Not my style of sled! I want a Apex because it is a groomed trail sled. I would not want a Nytro even if it had the Apex motor.

 

[blue er]

i heard 8 lbs between the 1049-3 and 998-4 is the difference think most of the problen is simply need a wider bulkhead for the 4 and the gear reduction almost forces the the engine to sit higher.
excited to see what's up yamaha's sleeve for sure maybe a rebirth of some old names like srx or v-max4 as for engine tech or clutching i love the sound of my 4 cyl but if they figure out 12000rpm clutching i would think it would have to be steel belt driven in a oil filled sealed case or something to that end
As for weight really how much could you take off current chassis? looking at the wet weights of other 4 stroke sleds in the market with newest technology apex could shave 50 lbs and be right.

 

[devinzz1]

speaking of a new engine from yamaha...

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/649/14457 ... ncept.aspx

 

[Sasquatch]

i heard 8 lbs between the 1049-3 and 998-4 is the difference think most of the problen is simply need a wider bulkhead for the 4 and the gear reduction almost forces the the engine to sit higher.
excited to see what's up yamaha's sleeve for sure maybe a rebirth of some old names like srx or v-max4 as for engine tech or clutching i love the sound of my 4 cyl but if they figure out 12000rpm clutching i would think it would have to be steel belt driven in a oil filled sealed case or something to that end
As for weight really how much could you take off current chassis? looking at the wet weights of other 4 stroke sleds in the market with newest technology apex could shave 50 lbs and be right.

I don't think the gear reduction makes the motor sit any higher! But that aside how do you make it any lower? I'd hate to have the motor lower then the skid plate. I mean at what point is the underchassis to low?

I think the first thing that most do to is lower the front end of the sled. A drop of 2 or 3 inches on the front lowers the COG by a huge amount. Worked wonders on my RX. Waiting to pick up my new Apex XTX to see what it is like!

12,000 plus rpm clutching sounds great I'm not sure how they would make a CVT lighter then the belt system as the two clutches and a belt weighs very little. But bring it on!

Making the Apex lighter would mean eliminating the delta box frame. Its heavy just to look at. But its tough. Maybe titainium would work. When you look at what Doo and Cat have done to stiffen the frame its bare minimum will it last 40,000 miles and take the abuse?

Yamaha in my opinion overbuilds things. Doo and Cat builds the minimum needed. If you push all three to the limit which one breaks under the stress first? So a lighter sled is great but not at a sacrifice of strength.

 

[blue er]

I agree yams are built solid hard to say where they could take weight out i would think the first place is the multi piece tunnel then go from there, i not sure they could roll the engine down any further without changing rear exit exhaust, or interfering with fuel tank mount maybe some way outta the box ideas turn engine sideways drop into belly pan like a rwd car move it back to where gas tank is and move fuel tank to front looking forward to seeing to some new tech as much as i luv my 06 apex getting the itch for something new