Yamaha warranty very questionable - I hope reps are reading

[STAIN]

I know the Cat dealer who fixes these tank seals uses NAPA "right stuff" silicone sealer and lets it sit overnight BEFORE adding the oil.
My tank is starting to seep after 8000 miles, not a large leak, but I will address it in the fall

 

[sailor joe]

I will pass along to the dealer to let the silicone dry overnight before adding oil, seems all who commented come to this conclusion...I would think the dealer should know this step, if not Knappattack is right . ...Thanks to all for your constructive comments, I appreciate it. Joe

 

[yamamarc]

And don't be staring at our Winders every time we stop...like the Doo riders in my group doo...Its creepy!

Hahahah I've seen the creepy stare on a few occasions..... good one!!

 

[Turboflash]

Silicone/RTV gasket-makers are used all the time by automotive engine builders in lieu of actual gaskets. Properly done, they never leak. I looked up "Right Stuff" on Permatex website and according to their information it is not the best product for this application. Ultra Black or Ultra Black Maximum would be better choices for maximum oil resistance.
It is critical for them to make very sure both surfaces are oil free. Wiping with a rag is not good enough. They have to thoroughly clean both sides carefully then remove oil residue with acetone or lacquer thinner. Apply sealant and assemble without sliding the two sides laterally. They need to have it lined up when the two sides touch. I assume they are sealing the oil tank to the chain case half while it is removed from sled? They could do it in the sled but I would worry about oil residue since they have filled the oil tank multiple times.
As KA says, it's not rocket science to seal this case. They are doing something wrong if they can't get it done.
Good luck!

 

[yamamarc]

Right on Nitro my Viper with Hurricane 190 kit gave all the 850'S in my neck of the woods fits on the trail or lake. I can't wait to lay the smack down on there candy #*$&@'s with my new Winder. I do believe that some guys are just not ment to own a Winder especially those who like to ride standing up.

Or pee sitting down

 

[WinterWolf]

Hey Joe,
At this point leave it where it is, and pass on the info to your dealer. As you stated in your post about the nightmare of starting over with a new dealer and a 10 hour round trip...it isn’t worth that imo.

This design by cat is just another one of their sub par engineering blunders that should have been Addressed and corrected years ago. But yet it isn’t and continues to plague many folks.

Wish you the best my friend!

 

[sailor joe]

Its the only move I got, that is to leave it where it is...the dealer will once again bring the issue up with Yamaha. I'm not taking a 10 hour round trip...for something that seems an easy fix. Once out of warranty I'm definitely getting the BOP gasket. It's going to be an interesting next season if the leak comes back...assuming they can fix it this time. I absolutely love riding this sled, so much better than the Venture and the wife likes it too. I don't want a different brand machine but I do want what I paid $16k for to work properly..hope that's not too much to ask for from Yamaha. It's going to suck if I have to check for oil leaks every time I come to an intersection or stop on the trail next season...that is not confidence in your sled. Thanks Winterwolf, stay safe.

 

[WinterWolf]

Its the only move I got, that is to leave it where it is...the dealer will once again bring the issue up with Yamaha. I'm not taking a 10 hour round trip...for something that seems an easy fix. Once out of warranty I'm definitely getting the BOP gasket. It's going to be an interesting next season if the leak comes back...assuming they can fix it this time. I absolutely love riding this sled, so much better than the Venture and the wife likes it too. I don't want a different brand machine but I do want what I paid $16k for to work properly..hope that's not too much to ask for from Yamaha. It's going to suck if I have to check for oil leaks every time I come to an intersection or stop on the trail next season...that is not confidence in your sled. Thanks Winterwolf, stay safe.

Yes..I Completely understand. When things like this happen..multiple times over again, it’s The confidence factor that starts to eat at an owner after a while.

 

[Fast]

ok, then yes it is the oil tank that is leaking...I've never taken apart one, so I'm not technically sure what exact oil is leaking but believe it is engine oil.

How many times have the installed it? Since they have a weird self tapping screw,they need to put new scews in each time, maybe they won't tighten enough now

 

[justinator]

Its the only move I got, that is to leave it where it is...the dealer will once again bring the issue up with Yamaha. I'm not taking a 10 hour round trip...for something that seems an easy fix. Once out of warranty I'm definitely getting the BOP gasket. It's going to be an interesting next season if the leak comes back...assuming they can fix it this time. I absolutely love riding this sled, so much better than the Venture and the wife likes it too. I don't want a different brand machine but I do want what I paid $16k for to work properly..hope that's not too much to ask for from Yamaha. It's going to suck if I have to check for oil leaks every time I come to an intersection or stop on the trail next season...that is not confidence in your sled. Thanks Winterwolf, stay safe.

I feel for you, as others have mentioned this isnt rocket science. Theres no special schooling for applying gasket maker and being successful. They must be attempting to do it on the sled or refilling with oil before its cured or just poor prep. I cant imagine being employed as a mechanic at a dealership and not being able to successfully seal something with silicone??? Doesnt make sense. I am thankful for my ability to do my own work on 99% of projects because my patience runs thin with incompetence. I am fortunate to have one of the best yamaha mechanics in the country right here in town if I ever get in over my head. Best of luck to you. I hope they get it right this time.

 

[rtx moose]

Hey Joe,
At this point leave it where it is, and pass on the info to your dealer. As you stated in your post about the nightmare of starting over with a new dealer and a 10 hour round trip...it isn’t worth that imo.

This design by cat is just another one of their sub par engineering blunders that should have been Addressed and corrected years ago. But yet it isn’t and continues to plague many folks.

Wish you the best my friend!

just an FYI on getting a skidoo,i have 2 friends blow there motor(850"s) one with 1400miles the other with 3000 this year.that shocked me cause i thought this problem was fixed

 

[KnappAttack]

just an FYI on getting a skidoo,i have 2 friends blow there motor(850"s) one with 1400miles the other with 3000 this year.that shocked me cause i thought this problem was fixed

The only fix for blowing up two-strokes is to buy a four-stroke. Two-stroke will never have the reliability of a four-stroke.

 

[sailor joe]

ok, things are getting clearer now, when I brought the machine in for 500 mile service I waited for the machine for 3 hours, not knowing it takes overnight to cure the silicone gasket. after a days use it was leaking on the truck going home. Brought to the dealers sister shop ( its got several shops under the same name) near my house. Since then, 2 months later and 3 new chain case covers its still leaking.
Justinator, could you pass along the name of the mechanic in town for future reference? If you live in Rangeley I know who you're talking about...Mike.

 

[kinger]

I drove the 20.5 XRS and it has the power/pull we like up to about 70mph. I was very impressed, thinking it would be a slug compared to 300hp apex and 280hp winder. I did 300 miles and it was a very fun sled, I had no real negative comments. It isn't the holy grail by any means but its amazingly capable out of the box. The nice thing is that when they blow (which is more rare on a volume/unit basis) they send a motor overnight and have you back on the trail in less then 3 days. The winder sitting in the shop for 9 months waiting on Yamaha/Cat parts is extremely frustrating. I get it all, I used to be a loyalist, however now I will pay attention to what other manufacturers are doing and when its not running how they respond and handle the warranty issues. I watched two Doo 850s come in, one with a split case with less then 500 miles, all stock clearly a defect. The one day I was there they pulled it out and sent pictures to Doo, the next day a new motor showed up in a crate. The 3rd day it was out the door. I'm no longer scared of a 2 stroke "blowing" up, its no different then a winder overheating, busting suspension, or any of the other issues in the Master Issues list I created. They all ruin a trip, its how fast you can get it back and go again that is now more important. I'm going back to building a boosted apex because it lasts for the winter and if it does break I can fix it myself usually quickly. I'm only doing that because I want a high 300hp crazy sled that tries to kill me, if you care more about fun and less about speed I can see why the Doos are popular.

 

[WinterWolf]

The only fix for blowing up two-strokes is to buy a four-stroke. Two-stroke will never have the reliability of a four-stroke.

Yes, Very true...in most cases, but not all. There always are exceptions. Had my 2000 T Cat for 6 years and put on 11,000 miles Without even a hiccup...I had a good one obviously. As I mentioned before every brand has its issues...and certainly not bashing any thing/any brand of sled.

I sell or trade in after about 4 years in most cases( a few exceptions like with my Apex that I kept for 9 years cuz it was fabulous) now a days anyway. And I don’t pile that many miles on Per year like some folks do(1200-1500 miles/yr).

So I’m not looking for years and years of service out of my sleds for the most part. But I do expect them to hold together without Major issue for the most part while I have them for that span of time..especially for the price we pay for them today. And Without repeated issues or having to reengineer the whole sled , because the factory will not address an obvious problem(s) that many customers are experiencing. That’s what becomes irritating to an owner.

I loved my Winder..but some Repeated(not Motor of course) problems that shorten trips and force you to start questioning if your sled will make it through the day/trip, or what will go next will rob you of the joy...and with only 2900 miles on it, I increasingly found that to be unacceptable to me.

As sailorjoe said, he’s not a mechanic, and neither am I. I’m no dummy and know my way around my sleds and their motors, but I don’t Have the tools nor the equipment/place to wrench on my sleds before and after every trip. Nor do I want to. I want to have it dialed in by the pros, and then go and ride it and enjoy it for the winter. I’m a stickler for maintenance, and keep my sleds immaculate and at 100% all the time. I don’t neglect nor beat my equipment to a pulp..but I do expect them to deliver what they are intended to deliver with the care and money I dedicate to them through routine and proper maintenance.

I’ve had 10 sleds since 1984 when I bought my first sled at 16 years old. Pretty much all Arctic Cat through 2005. All great sleds. Bought a Mach Z X ski Doo in 06. Sled was solid..never blew a belt and they were belt blowers and engine blowers, but mine was solid. Then went to an Apex and loved it!! Made me want to stay with Yamaha for the Incredible quality and reliability/durability. Unfortunately for me...I have not found that same type of build quality from my Winder. And probably because it’s not a pure Yamaha. No bashing cuz I’ve had the three brands(except Poo so far)and have had great sleds.

Love four Strikes and the turbo four strokes are awesome. Certainly not ruling out buying another one down the line at all. And would definitely look at another Yamaha when that time comes. But for next season gonna try the Doo XRS 850. It comes with 4 years of warranty so no issues with cost if it went down(so hoping it doesn’t lol).

And Kinger your post is spot on my friend!