ZX-2 problems-It moves on cement floor. What do you think?

[tkuss]

I was going to post this in the older "ZX-2 doesn't move" thread but then after writing it, realized it was a bit different so I started my old thread.
Anyway, my ZX-2 in my Apex moves on the garage floor. Not alot, but when jumping up and down on the floor boards I can move it 3 inches or so. Why can I move mine when others claim there's doesn't move? The reason I ask is because its seems that I am able to bottom mine alot more than the average person on this site. Most claim they have maybe bottomed twice in the 2000 miles or so. With me when I am pounding through the big 2 foot rollers and landing in the face of the next bump I can bottom it out each time if i push hard. Is this normal for you guys as well? I am just trying to figure out that if the people who can't move there suspension on the garage floor, have a very very hard time bottoming the suspension out.

I am trying to diagnose if my problem has to do with setup, or if I just ride it too hard and need to valve stiffer so I can jump and really push the sled with out bottoming out.

I should also mention that I have an 08 Nytro RTX that is set to full stiff, and it is much harder to bottom out than my Apex with the ZX-2 set to full stiff. In fact, I don't think I ever bottomed the Nytro out.

Would also just like to say that I love the ZX-2 very much. I would say that right now it is 80% perfect. I do push it very hard and just want to get rid of the bottoming that I experience. If I can do that, for me it would be 95% or so perfect. For reference, the stock monoshock was probably 50% perfect for me.


Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[kinger]

What are your revolver and preload settings at right now? Also do you have the two shock set up or just one shock?

I set my preload at 5 by the book for a aggressive rider for my weight and NEVER bottomed out, I went down to 2 just for S**** and giggles and it rode MUCH nicer in the trail chop but I did bottom out 3 times this year that was a first. I go 220-230 with gear and I dont let up in the moguls I think I'm fairly aggressive although I know of one maniac with no family that will go faster then me no matter what, otherwise I'm the fastest.

When i jump on mine the garage it does move maybe a 1-2" but compared to the edge that moved 5-6" it feels like nothing so maybe i confused some people saying it doesn't move, there is give to it.

 

[Jigger]

I have a one shock version, set at 3. On a recent trip with my wife I forgot to increase the preload and bottomed out about four-five times. You could feel the skid move and not rebound. I felt the rear of the sled riding lower on the trail until I let off the gas and the spring was able to rebound. It was a strange feeling, I asked the wife if she noticed it but we know her answer (no) . That said at 3 preset I have bottomed mine out a number of times through out the years. Mine moves 1-2 inches in the shop. But when we took a break from riding on the trip and I was looking over the skid it was moving at least 3". I think the shock had a little bit of fade and may need to be rebuilt this summer. I haven't had it out since the double up ride.

 

[tkuss]

Right now the revolver is set at 2-5. Spring preload is at 5. I had it up to 7 and was still able to bottom out on the big g-outs and jumps where I get about 2-3 feet off the ground. I turned it back down to 5 just because the stutter bumps were beating me up on the trail. Also I have the dual shock zx-2.

I don't know who has driven one, but like I said earlier, for reference I have a much harder time bottoming an 08 nytro RTX set stiff than the ZX-2 set stiff. I bought the ZX-2 skid used with 1000 miles. It now has 3500 miles total on it. Maybe the shocks just need a rebuild and not a revalve? But ever since I had it I was always able to bottom it over the big hits.

Over summer I am extending to 144". You guys think that will make softer? Or maybe even harder to bottom? I guess overall I am looking for a set-up where I can catch 4-5 feet of air and not bottom it out super hard like I would now. Do you guys think a revalve is needed? Can your guys ZX-2 stand up to a jump like that?

Thanks for the replies
Your help and opinions are very much appreciated.

Also for reference, in this little drop I bottomed the suspension out. So I don't really want to try anything bigger for fear of breaking something.

 

[Sasquatch]

I bottom mine out most every ride. But it bottoms out without driving my spine through my skull like my pro-action did. I touch bottom now and again. Nothing hard just hits bottom. This usually on the G-outs.

I paid a lot of money for the the ZX2 and I want my moneys worth of travel. I want every inch of travel I paid for and I get that from the skid.

Yes I can bottom it out but if your not bottoming on the big ones then your not getting all the travel of the suspension. So unless its bottoming hard as if its going to break the sled or you I would say its working.

Now I weigh well over 300pds and I have my spring on 7 and revolver on the two bottom holes on each side front and back. For touring its near perfect for me. For the small chop that forms on hard rode trails you know the stuff that tries to shake out your kidneys. Its awesome up to about a foot of chop at speed. After that the front can't keep up anymore and my kidneys cry.

For 2 foot moguls I slow down (way down) but in your case you say when you land on the face of the next bump. This is driving the front of the skid up maybe. So you may want to try a revolver setting that pushes the front of the skid into the bumps more. This would force the rear where the shocks are to react quicker.

Maybe you ride harder then most. Me I like the plush supple ride in the small stuff and am more then happy with the bigger bump handling. But I'm not a mogul basher. My 53 year old kidneys don't like that kind of abuse anymore. But I have gotten air borne off of big drops in the trail and the ZX2 lands them quite well considering there is well over half a ton landing on it.

For the air your looking for stiffer valving might work. Keep in mind you Apex is quite a bit heavier then the Nytro.

 

[Grimm]

I found that keeping your track tighter than usual helps with the sag factor...give it a try.

 

[tkuss]

Thanks for the replies. I don't know what to do. I am now thinking everything is fine with my skid. Obviously I am not riding anymore. Over summer I may or may not send my shocks in for a rebuild or revalve. All depends on my money situation at the time. Sure wish these shocks had compression/ rebound adjustment. Like I said earlier, I am happy with the ride now, just want to cure that bottoming on the big hits, so I can push the sled a bit more. But I don't want to revalve the shocks and things come out worse than they are now.

Thanks for the replys.

Anybody know why the longer mountain skids have only 1 shock and not 2? Common sense tells me that the longer the rails are-the more leverage they get- and therefore are able to put much more force/torque into the suspension. Thus requiring 2 shocks and not just one. But this is not so.

 

[SnoWarrior]

Sounds like the shocks could use service.
I sent mine back to Bruce at Pioneer Performance at the end of last season to be serviced. He said the oil was contaminated, as they must have been ridden hard.

Yes they were and I only bottomed out a couple of times in Canada when going over big G outs at 70 mph.

Shocks set at 5 and I am about 230lbs

They were serviced with 3000 miles on them. I am sending them back to Bruce as soon as I get the skid out.

The skid has taken a beating for close to 6000 miles and has held up great.
Nothing broken or lose. NO parts replaced, and rides great.

I was never able to ride this sled this hard with the old skid for fear of meeting Mr. Tree. When it got rough, the sled was all over the place.
With the ZX2 I have full control of my steering when it gets rough.

I am looking to buy a new sled, but don't know if I can give up this skid.

 

[tkuss]

I know it is hard to tell after not riding a sled for 9 months. But did you notice a difference after the shocks were rebuilt.

 

[kinger]

I would try a revalve its cheap and could solve most of your problems, maybe have Bruce at pioneer put a tad thicker fluid in them.

As to you questions on the 4-5ft jumps, I did one at like 25-30 mph the type where you jump high and land track and skis at the same time and almost double over because you almost stopped moving, and it bottomed out on that one, as did my GYTR's

I have jumped other jumps before, one was coming off a drift like a cornice where I dropped down into the ditch (deep ditch big drift on top of the ditch) and I was going about 35-45mph and it was the type where you land and you have it pinned the whole time and it did NOT bottom out then. The 'fun' jumps I like are teh 3-5' over a ridge in the trail and I never bottomed on those. The one in your picture I bet I would bottom out on that one too. But like one guy said its not painful just awknowledge it and keep going LOL.

 

[SnoWarrior]

I know it is hard to tell after not riding a sled for 9 months. But did you notice a difference after the shocks were rebuilt.

I did notice the shocks were getting just a little softer at the end of last season. After service they seemed the same as when they were new.
I did not have him revalve, as I like the way my sled rides.
I do not have the rider forward, so I was not getting the "kick" in the rear.

As the fluid gets hot from lots of riding it breaks down. That is why I had them serviced.

 

[Handy]

I have about 3000 miles on my ZX2 after 2 seasons and the skid this year definetly is softer and bottoms occasionally. Mine is a dual shock 121 in an 05 Vector. I will have my shocks serviced this summer to bring it back to original. This is the best riding skid for all around trail riding. The mono is better on small trail chatter but really looses ride quality fast as the trail deteriorate. When my ZX2 was new it rarely bottomed but all shocks need rebuilding after a few thousand miles. I do find myself riding faster and harder over rough trails than I ever could with the stock Pro Active skid.

 

[Jigger]

tkuss were you in Northern Ontario the first week of April? I saw a sled just like your's.

 

[tkuss]

Nope, never been there.