2020 Release

[sideswipe77]

what if yamaha and ac worked together to build a better 2 stroke. You guys have said yamaha is really good at building motors from what it sounds like ac 2s did not do so well with problems like they have had in the past with there motors. So if yamaha gets 2s would ac also make money on yamaha selling 2s. If they are staying together wouldn't it benefit them both to have a rocking 2s. So if they both climbed the ladder to move up in sales. Wouldn't ac be better off getting yamahas knowledge in the 2s area.

 

[Mototown]

From what I heard yesterday the trade agreement still has 3 more years. Also heard that Yamaha's goal is to have all business segments to be profitable, including sleds! And one more thing, there's going to be more shuffling in management on the snowmobile side! Combining departments, another corporate squeeze!

Most of the management shuffling was done a couple years ago , with Canadian division taking over snowmobile side then . To make the snowmobile division profitable they just have looked at what's been selling ... 600 & 850 2 strokes ,

 

[whitedust1]

what if yamaha and ac worked together to build a better 2 stroke. You guys have said yamaha is really good at building motors from what it sounds like ac 2s did not do so well with problems like they have had in the past with there motors. So if yamaha gets 2s would ac also make money on yamaha selling 2s. If they are staying together wouldn't it benefit them both to have a rocking 2s. So if they both climbed the ladder to move up in sales. Wouldn't ac be better off getting yamahas knowledge in the 2s area.

Sure Textron can have anything they want to fund with shared or non shared costs for 2s development. Yamaha would be very interested to develop and tool up a contracted Yamaha 2s that’s what they do build engines. But understand the enormity of the task for Yamaha to build a state of the art 850 starting at ground zero. Maybe Yamaha could develop and test an 850 in 3 years but where will Polaris and Doo be in 3 years? Also Textron would be scrapping all they have invested in their 600 and 800 not a likely event. Money makes the world go around and snowmobiles have been a shrinking market for years now. Both Yamaha and Textron are saying to each othe...Show me the money!!!

 

[greatwhite89]

I see three different scenarios playing out or a combination there of for 2020.

1. 998 N/A three cylinder to fill void in 600 class
2. 4 cylinder motor in fresh chassis
3. 850 two stroke in fresh chassis.

I say #1 is most plausible.

Now, in the meantime enjoy what you have to ride for this season and make the most of winter that always seems to go too quick! If we keep looking ahead we will never take the time to appreciate what's already in front of us. Life is short! Rant over.

 

[Mototown]

They decided direction of 2020 sleds before textron was in the picture.
I don't think Yamaha would go down the road of making another 120-140 hp big cc 4s unless the chassis is revolutionary , because they already know it's not a big seller.

 

[Snorunner]

I will date myself here Yamaha built a 2 cylinder 350 2 stroke street bike sold in the US in1983 & 1984. It was sold for a little longer in other markets. RZ 350 it had electronically controlled exhaust valves. It was badass! They dominated road Racing with these bikes. They even built a 4 cylinder RZ 500. Both were water cooled. The RD 350 aircooled was known as the giant killer. They could beat a 750 4 stroke. I had one of these and I beat a 79 Z28 Camero. Stoplight to stoplight of course. The Arctic Cat 600 has windows in the pistons on the intake side just like Yamaha did in the seventies. So if Yamaha really wants to build a 2 stroke again they could. Just sayin. I love 2 strokes power to weight ratio. But I am older now so just changing oil and turning the key really appeals to me. I am only interested in building a 2 stroke ice drag machine now days!

 

[stevewithOCD]

I will date myself here Yamaha built a 2 cylinder 350 2 stroke street bike sold in the US in1983 & 1984. It was sold for a little longer in other markets. RZ 350 it had electronically controlled exhaust valves. It was badass! They dominated road Racing with these bikes. They even built a 4 cylinder RZ 500. Both were water cooled. The RD 350 aircooled was known as the giant killer. They could beat a 750 4 stroke. I had one of these and I beat a 79 Z28 Camero. Stoplight to stoplight of course. The Arctic Cat 600 has windows in the pistons on the intake side just like Yamaha did in the seventies. So if Yamaha really wants to build a 2 stroke again they could. Just sayin. I love 2 strokes power to weight ratio. But I am older now so just changing oil and turning the key really appeals to me. I am only interested in building a 2 stroke ice drag machine now days!

I believe those 350's competed in the 500 2-stroke class

 

[stevewithOCD]

I would bet my last dollar that Yamaha has been working on 2-stroke technology the whole time.
It may not be a snowmobile engine, but they've been working on them.
Yamaha is too big, smart & successful to not keep up with research into ALL technologies.
Rumor has it, they helped Infinity develop the "adjustable compression engine". Very interesting. Look it up.
They have dabbled in electric cars & motors. Robots driving motorcycles and 5 stroke motors.

My point is this. If the Big Cheese called up the R&D department and said "i want a crazy tech 600 for a snowmobile in 8 weeks", there would be one on his doorstep in 6.

 

[whitedust1]

They decided direction of 2020 sleds before textron was in the picture.
I don't think Yamaha would go down the road of making another 120-140 hp big cc 4s unless the chassis is revolutionary , because they already know it's not a big seller.

Yeah I don’t see the 120 - 140 hp market 2s or 4s market being of interest unless Yamaha and AC can manufacture a value sled on the cheap and still make money. Otherwise the money is being spent at 100 hp via the Ace and 180 hp + currently. The Vector engine is packed with proven technology just needs a chassis.

 

[whitedust1]

I would bet my last dollar that Yamaha has been working on 2-stroke technology the whole time.
It may not be a snowmobile engine, but they've been working on them.
Yamaha is too big, smart & successful to not keep up with research into ALL technologies.
Rumor has it, they helped Infinity develop the "adjustable compression engine". Very interesting. Look it up.
They have dabbled in electric cars & motors. Robots driving motorcycles and 5 stroke motors.

My point is this. If the Big Cheese called up the R&D department and said "i want a crazy tech 600 for a snowmobile in 8 weeks", there would be one on his doorstep in 6.

And where does the funding come from for these projects? Only way for any developement is via budgeted funding. No one knows this better than Big Cheese management.

 

[sideswipe77]

if they both fund it and they both use it to increase there sales doesn't that make sense when you share in the r&d. So why couldn't yamaha get a better suspension from cat for helping them develop an awsome 2s that will run for a long time and get good fuel economy. I don't think yamaha have lost there touch in building a good 2s. maybe they was waiting to put it in a better suspension that they was not able to build. Like you guys said the suspension is not there strong point.

 

[Snorunner]

That's why I am saying if they wanted to build a 2Stroke they could. Can anybody think of a Snowmobile built in 1983 with electronically controlled power valves. So pop a cold one and wait. I bought the latest edition of Snowtech and not one mention of Yamahas future plans that should tell us something!

 

[whitedust1]

if they both fund it and they both use it to increase there sales doesn't that make sense when you share in the r&d. So why couldn't yamaha get a better suspension from cat for helping them develop an awsome 2s that will run for a long time and get good fuel economy. I don't think yamaha have lost there touch in building a good 2s. maybe they was waiting to put it in a better suspension that they was not able to build. Like you guys said the suspension is not there strong point.

Your still not considering corporate budgets and ROI. AC and Yamaha doesnt trade bits and pieces of their technology everything is bought and sold to a budget. How many units at what profit over a defined period of time. Neither company owns much market share Doo and Polaris are the market leaders by a wide margin. Where do the forecasted sales come from to support this 2s? Again it’s show me the money from both Textron and Yamaha. It’s obvious Yamaha couldn’t show Textron the money to continue growing the Viper and Sidewinder product lines thus inventory reduction program.

 

[sideshowBob]

I will date myself here Yamaha built a 2 cylinder 350 2 stroke street bike sold in the US in1983 & 1984. It was sold for a little longer in other markets. RZ 350 it had electronically controlled exhaust valves. It was badass! They dominated road Racing with these bikes. They even built a 4 cylinder RZ 500. Both were water cooled. The RD 350 aircooled was known as the giant killer. They could beat a 750 4 stroke. I had one of these and I beat a 79 Z28 Camero. Stoplight to stoplight of course. The Arctic Cat 600 has windows in the pistons on the intake side just like Yamaha did in the seventies. So if Yamaha really wants to build a 2 stroke again they could. Just sayin. I love 2 strokes power to weight ratio. But I am older now so just changing oil and turning the key really appeals to me. I am only interested in building a 2 stroke ice drag machine now days!

1985 RZ500 V4 2 Stroke, reed valve electronic Power Valves....still have mine

 

[sideshowBob]

1985 RZ500 V4 2 Stroke, reed valve electronic Power Valves....still have mine