2020 Release

[whitedust1]

The comments of Yamaha to merge and buy AC are wishful thinking imo Yamaha is NOT interested. Yamaha has an OEM Agreement to have access to the services they want and that is money in Textron’s pocket. Yamaha and AC never used EPS possibility because Yamaha wants to keep that for Yamaha only models. Yamaha will have a new 4s EPS sled for us but maybe Spring only orders.

 

[T-Bone]

MSRP of my 2006 Apex GT was $10,900. Inflation takes that number to about $13,700 in todays dollars. MSRP of 2018 APEX $15,600, so yes sleds are getting more expensive today than in the past. Price increase of on average of $158.00/year over inflation. It cost a lot more money to build high performance 4-strokes

The comments of Yamaha to merge and buy AC are wishful thinking imo Yamaha is NOT interested. Yamaha has an OEM Agreement to have access to the services they want and that is money in Textron’s pocket. Yamaha and AC never used EPS possibility because Yamaha wants to keep that for Yamaha only models. Yamaha will have a new 4s EPS sled for us but maybe Spring only orders.

Well I don't see that happening if we are going on what the manufactures say, Chris Reed has said numerous times that without ROI no new R&D and with only selling 11,000 units, thats not enough of a return to even turn on the lights. I hope you are correct on the new 4S EPS.

 

[Deeppow16]

I truly believe the market needs a reset and not just Yamaha sled...all of them. This sport is getting very expensive and hard for new families to get involved. All of us that grew up in it, and have affect others to join are getting less and less every year. Manufacturers need to break the mold and change direction to get more people into the sport.

That is the ugly truth about this sport. The average family cant afford it. The sport of sledding has become a rich mans sport and that really sucks because its fun and for me its a chance to get away and clear my mind but its getting harder to find the money to go on trips. Sled manufactures need to stop increasing prices because they are pricing a lot of people right out of the sport. Yes I know there are used sleds out there that people can afford but that's not the point. Its only a matter of time before the sport starts to decline sharply because these prices are getting insane. Not to mention the gear. My god that is expensive!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you want a nice jacket and bibs your looking at $800-1000. That's just stupid. Yes the gear is better then ever but damn. Things need to be reset like you said otherwise I see big problems coming.

 

[whitedust1]

That is the ugly truth about this sport. The average family cant afford it. The sport of sledding has become a rich mans sport and that really sucks because its fun and for me its a chance to get away and clear my mind but its getting harder to find the money to go on trips. Sled manufactures need to stop increasing prices because they are pricing a lot of people right out of the sport. Yes I know there are used sleds out there that people can afford but that's not the point. Its only a matter of time before the sport starts to decline sharply because these prices are getting insane. Not to mention the gear. My god that is expensive!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you want a nice jacket and bibs your looking at $800-1000. That's just stupid. Yes the gear is better then ever but damn. Things need to be reset like you said otherwise I see big problems coming.

How should software and sled OEMs reset? You will never buy more for less. As far as cheaper sleds Polaris is addressing that market with the cookie cutter Indy 2s.

 

[biffdotorg]

How should software and sled OEMs reset? You will never buy more for less. As far as cheaper sleds Polaris is addressing that market with the cookie cutter Indy 2s.

Polaris has the right idea with the Indy and Indy evo. SkiDoo with the Sports. After a year or two, these sleds are even more affordable.

Two paths, you can build a complete line that addresses those getting into the sport, or you can build a top performing rocketship that most want, but would never justify buying. Where is the margin the most?

The Polaris and SkiDoo's of the world will build full lines and address the concern of getting folks into the sport. Yamaha may turn into the boutique builder and only make spring order machines, but they may be top of the line on the fit and finish scale as well as top performers. That will be profitable business for them. But it won't make many Yamaha fanboys happy.

If you start your kids on 120/200/340cc starter sleds that are red or yellow, they will never grow into the crowd that will jump ship for a $25,000 boutique sled from Yamaha.

 

[whitedust1]

Polaris has the right idea with the Indy and Indy evo. SkiDoo with the Sports. After a year or two, these sleds are even more affordable.

Two paths, you can build a complete line that addresses those getting into the sport, or you can build a top performing rocketship that most want, but would never justify buying. Where is the margin the most?

The Polaris and SkiDoo's of the world will build full lines and address the concern of getting folks into the sport. Yamaha may turn into the boutique builder and only make spring order machines, but they may be top of the line on the fit and finish scale as well as top performers. That will be profitable business for them. But it won't make many Yamaha fanboys happy.

If you start your kids on 120/200/340cc starter sleds that are red or yellow, they will never grow into the crowd that will jump ship for a $25,000 boutique sled from Yamaha.

I totally agree no entry level sleds interest me at all I want EPS the best shocks ,NA 150hp plus 4s prestudded tracks and the best electronic screen pod ,fit and finish possible. If Spring only order I would buy and keep such a sled for at least 5 years. Yamaha has spoiled me to only want the best in a snowmobile. Yamaha has a huge void for entry level products but I’m not sure they are in or can compete in that market anyway.

 

[cobrajet ltx dx]

As a whole the manufacturers definitely need a reset.The technology in these sleds today are getting so advanced with respect to horsepower and speed that the actual areas that they are used in can’t support it.
There is a fine line.

IMO... I can totally see Yamaha being that niche manufacturer that builds high horsepower/ speed sleds that are mostly used for lake racing, hill drags,
Sanctioned races ect. And those owners will have there kids on the scoot’s playing around with them.

 

[Deeppow16]

I totally agree no entry level sleds interest me at all I want EPS the best shocks ,NA 150hp plus 4s prestudded tracks and the best electronic screen pod ,fit and finish possible. If Spring only order I would buy and keep such a sled for at least 5 years. Yamaha has spoiled me to only want the best in a snowmobile. Yamaha has a huge void for entry level products but I’m not sure they are in or can compete in that market anyway.

Yeah they can! Lose some of the tech. An entry level sled doesn't need a few thousand dollars worth of shocks on it. They don't need a fancy gauge on them either or a heated seat. There are things that they can do to make sleds not cost $15000 plus for a sled.

 

[20/80]

Sleds that are built today are getting farther away from the reach of the every day sledder to afford, even the used market is pricy and risky without a warranty, the days of the simple to fix motors on your own are gone, sadly these type of sledders are the backbone of this sport, the guy's and gals that clean up the trails and build bridges and put on rallies for a good cause, you will find them every where and all around you and in most cases go on recognized because they are running a old sled that is all they can afford, to say this is a rich mans sport I beg to differ, it just takes a rich man to buy a new one, sled manufactures better start recognizing who the back bone of their industry is and start catering to them also, there is no reason why a sled manufacture could not build a 800 class sled for under 10 grand, they wonder why sales are down, people can't afford what they are asking.

 

[greatwhite89]

On top of very marginal winters the last 5 years.

Sleds that are built today are getting farther away from the reach of the every day sledder to afford, even the used market is pricy and risky without a warranty, the days of the simple to fix motors on your own are gone, sadly these type of sledders are the backbone of this sport, the guy's and gals that clean up the trails and build bridges and put on rallies for a good cause, you will find them every where and all around you and in most cases go on recognized because they are running a old sled that is all they can afford, to say this is a rich mans sport I beg to differ, it just takes a rich man to buy a new one, sled manufactures better start recognizing who the back bone of their industry is and start catering to them also, there is no reason why a sled manufacture could not build a 800 class sled for under 10 grand, they wonder why sales are down, people can't afford what they are asking.

 

[Vmax]

That is the ugly truth about this sport. The average family cant afford it. The sport of sledding has become a rich mans sport and that really sucks because its fun and for me its a chance to get away and clear my mind but its getting harder to find the money to go on trips. Sled manufactures need to stop increasing prices because they are pricing a lot of people right out of the sport. Yes I know there are used sleds out there that people can afford but that's not the point. Its only a matter of time before the sport starts to decline sharply because these prices are getting insane. Not to mention the gear. My god that is expensive!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you want a nice jacket and bibs your looking at $800-1000. That's just stupid. Yes the gear is better then ever but damn. Things need to be reset like you said otherwise I see big problems coming.

Oh man...…. have you completely nailed the whole issue with todays snowmobiling. I have mentioned this in past threads. I am just getting back into sledding with a used 1997 Vmax but did purchase FXR riding gear and man that was an eye opener. I have resources but can't imagine spending 18+K on a sled, but then again if I lived in mid/northern Ontario I may think differently

Snowmobiling has become a "who can afford the most expensive" very sad to this old timer

 

[sideshowBob]

The price of the new sleds and the reality of only new YamaCats for now, and in the future, motivates me to maintain and update my Attak every year. I probably will end up on a new YamaCat eventually...but only when I have to. Currently installing a new Ice Attack track for this season.

 

[jjmoneysauce]

I wonder if Yamaha has abandoned sensibly priced sleds altogether. The VK540 is the cheapest at around 11k CAD, but sadly I think the days of accessible sleds like Bravos and Enticers may be done. Even those kiddie sleds are over 5 grand now. The only way I could get my whole family on the snow is by buying 80s Enticers!

 

[maim]

trust me those are not going for cheap around here jj. gf is getting sleds for her god children for christmas and the inital buget was to spend less than $1000.00 for 2 sleds i would fix up for them with stuff i have laying around. beat up used enticers start at $600 locally. working on a 1990 sprint 340 that i paid $250 for and am up to about $850 into with suspension parts, track drivers/bearings, tunnel extesion, ski, runners and idler wheels. does not count the used track and suspension i had laying around. the 2nd sled i have about $500 total into but i scored on it and paid $100 for it. the rest went into seat cover, bearings/wheels, wear bars, used tank,fuel filter, fuel pump and lines.

 

[jjmoneysauce]

Yeah you're right, they can get pricey. Out west, they are going for almost 2000 in good shape. Some of the real slick pickers can pick better deals tho.