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2023 Yamaha Snowmobile line up

Stubbs said:
Are you speaking about the end of the pogo era? Lol. I remember having the same types of conversations with my Dad back then, who had moved on to a few other brands until the trailing arm sleds arrived and he was back on Yamaha. We’ve started having the same conversations again the last couple of seasons. All four manufacturers do certain things really well, and are terrible at others, just the nature of different engineering priorities by OEM’s. I don’t wear the blue goggles, I understand the sleds I’ve loved ALL had their unique issues, I just can’t imagine the lack of pride in your product it takes to simply re-badge someone else’s unit, that’s sad af.
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No, I had good sources that they had considered exiting the sled market during the trailing arm era, but decided to stay in it, and then came the RX-1

I get your point about rebranding another brands sled, but isn't it true that they sell more of these machines dressed as blue, instead of green.
What if Textron sold the sled division to Yamaha but continued to produce Cats from the same factory? Then Cat loyalists would be upset?

It is business at the end of the day.
 

74Nitro said:
INo, I had good sources that they had considered exiting the sled market during the trailing arm era, but decided to stay in it, and then came the RX-1

I get your point about rebranding another brands sled, but isn't it true that they sell more of these machines dressed as blue, instead of green.
What if Textron sold the sled division to Yamaha but continued to produce Cats from the same factory? Then Cat loyalists would be upset?

It is business at the end of the day.
Click to expand...

I haven’t looked at sales numbers for anyone in a long time, and it would take some digging to get your hands on model specific numbers for each manufacturer, but there’s no doubt the blue four strokes out sell the green. When Yammy turned this corner I had been told by someone I trust that the end game was Yamaha purchasing Cat, but obviously that never materialized. Like I said, shared platforms with individual technology and identity I can get on board with, regardless of ownership, but that’s my threshold. I understand the pure business side of this, but if you are only capable of having someone paint their product your colours, and you’re not willing to bring anything of your own to an industry, you don’t deserve any long term support or market share.
 
Stubbs said:
I haven’t looked at sales numbers for anyone in a long time, and it would take some digging to get your hands on model specific numbers for each manufacturer, but there’s no doubt the blue four strokes out sell the green. When Yammy turned this corner I had been told by someone I trust that the end game was Yamaha purchasing Cat, but obviously that never materialized. Like I said, shared platforms with individual technology and identity I can get on board with, regardless of ownership, but that’s my threshold. I understand the pure business side of this, but if you are only capable of having someone paint their product your colours, and you’re not willing to bring anything of your own to an industry, you don’t deserve any long term support or market share.
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Agree some Yamaha specific aspects are important besides just the engine. I don't know how many are in there from the Yamaha side of sled development. Maybe someone else here knows.
Passion for the sled division is obviously lacking, and it's needed to succeed. There lots of it here on these boards however.
Maybe with demand so strong last year and this year, they will throw some more money at it, but a back drop of global warming talk doesn't help either.
 
74Nitro said:
Agree some Yamaha specific aspects are important besides just the engine. I don't know how many are in there from the Yamaha side of sled development. Maybe someone else here knows.
Passion for the sled division is obviously lacking, and it's needed to succeed. There lots of it here on these boards however.
Maybe with demand so strong last year and this year, they will throw some more money at it, but a back drop of global warming talk doesn't help either.
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I had a 2022 GT sno-checked that is cancelled. The Yamaha dealers are 45 minutes from where I live, while a Cat dealer is 2 miles up the road. I priced all three, and one of the Yamaha dealers was the best price. If the T-Cat wasn't gray I would have ordered it instead.
So I guess I do agree with you that there isn't enough Yamaha effort in this sled anymore to keep me from riding the all-Cat version.
 
KnappAttack said:
I believe this to be true. I dont see any MFGR making any changes other then BNG.
The way our winters have been going, I could very well be riding my 17 for many years to come as well, which is fine as I love the machine.

We still don't have ridable snow here at home on Jan 21st. Dont see it getting better in the future either.
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same here in the northeast...not enough snow...bumming me out. Stating to make me think that fishing in Florida is not such a bad idea.
 
KnappAttack said:
I believe this to be true. I dont see any MFGR making any changes other then BNG.
The way our winters have been going, I could very well be riding my 17 for many years to come as well, which is fine as I love the machine.

We still don't have ridable snow here at home on Jan 21st. Dont see it getting better in the future either.
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Rumor mill is strong and disagreeing with you. The demand for the more powerful Ace 900 Turbo in the Mach Z may see another year of that "limited" sled. And possibly another trail model with the boosted engine. But the rumor for a "spark" sled or budget build is strong as well. They know folks are looking for entry level. And they already announced the 600 efi as a budget engine over an Etec 600, so they are halfway there.

Polaris is getting rumors of the 850 boost coming to a trail sled too. Even though their 650 is being loved by many for power and economy, as well as the performance of the 850, owners in the poo crowd are begging for a factory boost engine in the trail sleds. They may get it.

Thats just a bit more than BNG from those two.
 
The parts shortage deal is too risky to bring much out for new equipment. A MFGR would have to be in control of all aspects of those parts and none are in that position. I just seen nothing new coming. They can't make deliveries of what they have orders for now in MY 22. Imagine trying to tool ANYTHING new up and deliver it on time? New machines mean all new tooling and parts to go with it. 2022 sleds are still being delivered into March. Think they will bering new sleds while the 22's are still not in owners hands? That'd be a poor decision on any MFGR, it'd take balls by any MFGR to bring ANYTHING new for 2023.

If it already uses common parts is that really anything new? No.
 
I’m in agreement, I don’t see much new stuff being offered from Poo, Doo or Yamaha for ‘23 as they can’t even produce their existing models on time. I do think Cat has something new to offer but whether they release in ‘23 or not is a big question. Car stands to gain the most from the current situation as they didn’t ship sleds until their were fully complete and ready to go. It seems like they handled the supply chain issues the best. Yamaha was the worst. They flat out canceled people’s snowchecks. If I’d ordered a Yamaha and had been torn at the time of that decision of possibly going with another brand I sure as heck wouldn’t give Yamaha a second chance to screw me again in ‘23.

Yamaha should just focus on producing their own kid sized sleds. Start building their fan base back small, focus on the entry level area of the market and build low priced, smaller machines and rebuild their sled program that way. I don’t want Yamaha to go away or abandon the sled market but I also WILL NOT buy a blue Arctic Cat just because it has a Yamaha sticker on the hood.
 
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Well you guys yamaha is still making sleds in Japan, nothing but utility sleds but there still pumping them out!!I can't see yamaha throwing in the towel on anything they make!!they still brag they are the only mfg of sleds that are all Japan built,no mutts!!!
 
I know the Mach Z isn’t as fast as the Sidewinder but my next sled will probably be a Renegade 900T. I like four strokes. My friend ordered one and it just showed up. Very nice sled.
 
74Nitro said:
No, I had good sources that they had considered exiting the sled market during the trailing arm era, but decided to stay in it, and then came the RX-1

I get your point about rebranding another brands sled, but isn't it true that they sell more of these machines dressed as blue, instead of green.
What if Textron sold the sled division to Yamaha but continued to produce Cats from the same factory? Then Cat loyalists would be upset?

It is business at the end of the day.
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Really? Next time you are in a Dealership that has earned awards from Yamaha look at them and read them. Yamaha company I thought and still hope is or was based on Pride. Quality/Service #1 for sure. All I want is 8,10,12,14,17mm and a good Phillips in my F'ing tool kit again! Nothing More. Just doing that alone would bring back the Mentality needed to produce the best sleds for customers. Yamaha Practice what you Preach!
 
number1kyster said:
I personally think you will see BNG for 2023.

I don't think we will see expanded EPS options either. Yamaha/Cat have had a difficult time delivering EPS sleds. Since the global supply issues are unlikely to change for 2023, I doubt they will be willing to offer it in more sleds.

I think for 2023 we are going to see less spring order options from all 4 brands. I also expect shorter snow check windows, or caps on how many of each models can be sold. Prices will likely go up substantially since the manufacturers know that they can sell more sleds than they are capable of producing.
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I think your right
 
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