Engine builders, oil system priming

[kinger]

HI guys posted in general but need some hlep from people that tear into these sleds often.

I just installed my engine and fired right up, the engine was removed only to re-build the waterpump, case was not opened. I looked in the oil tank and saw circulation for about 2 seconds then it quit. I did the "plug the little hose from the tank and shoot some 3-5psi of air into the tank trick from peteracing and it didn't do anything". The system currently has 4 qts in it and still doesn't registere "E" on the dip stick (its just below)so I assume all the oil is in the crank case.

My new plan is to block the cranks case vent, disconnect the coils unplug the top hoses from the oil tank and plug the tank and just turn the machine over till 'hopefully' oil starts spitting out, then reconnect and fire. It has been run for about 20 seconds so far and I don't think there is any damage to anything.

Is it normally this hard to prime this thing? Any seceret suggestions I would appreciate it thanks!

 

[yel_low]

Drain engine+tank from oil, loosen oilfilter and fill upp oiltank with oil approx 2liters, put some pressure in oiltank and wait until it comes out from oilfilters place on engine, Mount back oilfilter and fire it up and se if pressure comes, you can measure on Oilpressure-contact on engine, you have Earth on contact until pressure comes.

dont forget to check oillevel

sorry my bad english, hope it will help you

 

[DoktorC]

I just finished this...it took a VERY long time for the engine to start pumping oil. I don't know about the RX but the Apex has a low oil pressure shut off...so the sled would only run about 15seconds then shut down. I kept pressurizing the tank, running, pressurizing...you get the picture. I finally gave up. Went to bed (after emailing Lakercr). The next evening (last night) I started the sled and it kept running, which means it has oil pressure...now...I'm alittle slow sometimes and I made a very ROOKIE mistake and kept looking for flow on the little hose (the one that attaches to the "pressizing hole") which only comes out in sperts and dribbles. Once I was challenged as to my thinking I checked the BIG black heavy hose and I had lots of flow and everything is fine.

I had about the same amount of oil into the system as you and was amazed at the amount of oil the I had to keep putting in but mine turned out right. I'm thinking letting it sit may have soaked the filter or let the air work out of it I dunno but it was A LONG process before mine pumped.

Have you checked for water flow? The pump shaft is also the oil drive so if it's not pumping water it won't be pumping oil....(first thing I checked when I was freaking out!!).

Good luck!

 

[kinger]

Thanks DoktorC I appreciate the lengthy post, I tried doing this last weekend and similar to you I have let it sit for a while (no time to work on it) and am seceretly hoping that any air in the system would have worked its way to the tank and out but knowing my luck it probably won't be tht easy. Teh coolant is circulating just fine but it was only run for a few seconds and the t-stat didn't even open up yet but all the hoses and pipes that flow around the engine were warming up.

I probably did the pressurizing thing like 12-15 times before I gave up. My big black hose was DRY though.

Think the plan I listed above will work or should I try starting her again and pray it pumps fine?

 

[FASTSLED]

oil prime

the best way is to set up temp pres guage no pres sht it off should have 55-60 psi cold also loosen 8mm bolt @head pto side oil galley bolt fast

 

[wheeline]

Here is what it says in the service manual. The oil gallery bolt is right above the outside header bolt on the clutch side.

10. Inspect:
 Engine oil pressure
Inspection steps:
 Slightly loosen the oil gallery bolt 1 .
 Start the engine and keep it idling until engine
oil starts to seep from the oil gallery bolt.
If no engine oil comes out after one minute,
turn the engine off so that it will not seize.
 Check the engine oil passages, the oil filter
and the oil pump for damage or leakage.
 Start the engine after solving the problem(-s)
and check the engine oil pressure again.
Tighten the oil gallery bolt to specification.

 

[Thomas800]

When you had the motor out did you remove the water pump from the case. If you did, did you line the lower sprocket up with the water pump / oilpump drive? Is it possible that either the chain is off the sprocket teeth on either the stub shaft or the pump drive sprocket? Could the drive shaft missed the sprocket all together. Either of those are possible if the motor was leaned over while the drive was out. I really hope not but I would hate to hear that you hurt it because you kept trying to start it with no oil pressure. Hopefully it's just a priming issue. Best of luck to you.

 

[DoktorC]

If the chain was off the water pump wouldn't circulate water, which it is. All that crazy stuff went through my head last night lol.

 

[DC5]

If you take the large black hose off the top of the oil tank and put a manual or electric suction pump on it and pump it a couple times it will prime the pump and it will pump oil as soon as the motor turns over. I just did this and it works much better than pressurizing the tank.

 

[Thomas800]

I didn't read your post all the way through DoktorC. I see you had that allready covered

 

[mulot30th]

If you take the large black hose off the top of the oil tank and put a manual or electric suction pump on it and pump it a couple times it will prime the pump and it will pump oil as soon as the motor turns over. I just did this and it works much better than pressurizing the tank.

I will try this on my apex motor...

I am in process of getting it fully built.

 

[maxdlx]

Kinger you going to work on this thing Sat morning. I am in Mn mabe I'll stop by. Maxdlx

 

[kinger]

Yeah I'll be working on it tommorrow. I'm 30 miles in to IA from teh MN border just off I-35.

DC5 I like your idea with the suction. Any pump reccomendations?

As far as if its assembled right I had Yamaha do all the work, they are real good mechanics there so I will trust that it is ok for now. I'm lucky to have a good dealership here.

Thanks guys I didn't even know about a 'bleed bolt' that is just like the coolant system, makes sense.

 

[rxrider]

HI guys posted in general but need some hlep from people that tear into these sleds often.

I just installed my engine and fired right up, the engine was removed only to re-build the waterpump, case was not opened. I looked in the oil tank and saw circulation for about 2 seconds then it quit. I did the "plug the little hose from the tank and shoot some 3-5psi of air into the tank trick from peteracing and it didn't do anything". The system currently has 4 qts in it and still doesn't registere "E" on the dip stick (its just below)so I assume all the oil is in the crank case.

My new plan is to block the cranks case vent, disconnect the coils unplug the top hoses from the oil tank and plug the tank and just turn the machine over till 'hopefully' oil starts spitting out, then reconnect and fire. It has been run for about 20 seconds so far and I don't think there is any damage to anything.

Is it normally this hard to prime this thing? Any seceret suggestions I would appreciate it thanks!

Been there done that

Here's the link back to when I were having the very same problem on my first turbo install.

http://www.ty4stroke.com/viewtopic.php? ... hlight=oil

MrSled/Mods - This thread deserves a sticky, as this question comes up rather often. The topic may be covered in other sticky posts tho

 

[DC5]

Yeah I'll be working on it tommorrow. I'm 30 miles in to IA from teh MN border just off I-35.

DC5 I like your idea with the suction. Any pump reccomendations?

As far as if its assembled right I had Yamaha do all the work, they are real good mechanics there so I will trust that it is ok for now. I'm lucky to have a good dealership here.

Thanks guys I didn't even know about a 'bleed bolt' that is just like the coolant system, makes sense.

I use the pump that came with my yamaha boat to change the oil. It is just a standard manual suction pump. You should be able to buy them at any yamaha dealership as all of their jet boats need them to change the oil. I think mine was $40.