Found the old zebco and tested the orange TPI secondary spring

fourload said:
As soon as we get some snow I will report . Will check back shift etc. I never had a problem with this spring even wrapped at 60. Saw 120 speedo on a lake run @ 8900. Couldn't get a lake run in @ 50 but it still was snappy with a good backshift. Maybe 40 will be the best all around ticket for backshift , upshift and top end on a stocker.
Click to expand...
Got 122mph gps with completely stock secondary and stock gearing. Gonna try my TP spring on the lake at the end of the week. Bringing my stock stuff also. Have a 22 gear now.
 
Shagnos said:
Got 122mph gps with completely stock secondary and stock gearing. Gonna try my TP spring on the lake at the end of the week. Bringing my stock stuff also. Have a 22 gear now.
Click to expand...
Very nice. I think stock gearing is almost tapped out at 122. I saw 120 mph @350 miles on the speedo(maybe 116-117gps?) with a tall grandpa windshield, stock helix, orange secondary @60, stock weights and stiffer orange primary spring. Hope to get out on the lake in similar conditions and test with my medium windshield and wrap @40. So many variables involved with conditions and suspension setups. End of season or summer going with the stock muffler race tune by Hurricane. Stealthy and should liven up throttle response with gaining a few MPH on top.
 
fourload said:
Very nice. I think stock gearing is almost tapped out at 122. I saw 120 mph @350 miles on the speedo(maybe 116-117gps?) with a tall grandpa windshield, stock helix, orange secondary @60, stock weights and stiffer orange primary spring. Hope to get out on the lake in similar conditions and test with my medium windshield and wrap @40. So many variables involved with conditions and suspension setups. End of season or summer going with the stock muffler race tune by Hurricane. Stealthy and should liven up throttle response with gaining a few MPH on top.
Click to expand...
I assume your orange primary spring is from TP. How do you like it verses the stocker. I just put the TP secondary spring in @50 I was told you have to change weights on the primary to get the orange primary spring to perform like it was designed to. Truth to that or? Did you lose any rpm with orange primary spring? Forgive my question if dumb. I am a newbie trying to pick up all the info I can.
 
STAIN said:
The stock Sidewinder helix is 35 degrees. It matches the flat profile of the primary weight. The ramp is very long and the helix moves a long way during shift out. When you install a stiffer spring, the helix moves so much that stiff spring really gets wound making it stiffer still. By taking a dual angle helix such as in my case a 45-41., the ramp is much sorter letting the stock spring to work as designed.
When choosing the helix angle for my SW, Mr. Lessard took into consideration the profile of the primary weight I was using. He then chose the helix angle to match the shift profile of the weights.
When you run a super stiff secondary spring, you slow or hold the shift of the secondary and loose clutch efficiency creating heat. You are using engine power to open the clutch instead of using power to move the sled forward. You want the primary and secondary shift rates to MATCH each other, not fight each other.
It seems that a lot of people here are clutching sleds for the first time, which is great. I love trying to make the clutches on my sleds work perfectly, it is half the fun of snowmobiling to me. BUT, remember that with the power of these Sidewinders it is easy to mask clutching inefficiency's. These sled will power right through some improper set ups. Try setting up a 60hp sled first , where every little change can be felt, good and bad.
Don't copy some one else's set ups, use them as a reference . Try things your self and get the sled to drive the way you want it to drive.

For what is worth, the world fastest sled uses a stock Apex secondary............
Click to expand...
what profile weight your using?
 
fourload said:
Very nice. I think stock gearing is almost tapped out at 122. I saw 120 mph @350 miles on the speedo(maybe 116-117gps?) with a tall grandpa windshield, stock helix, orange secondary @60, stock weights and stiffer orange primary spring. Hope to get out on the lake in similar conditions and test with my medium windshield and wrap @40. So many variables involved with conditions and suspension setups. End of season or summer going with the stock muffler race tune by Hurricane. Stealthy and should liven up throttle response with gaining a few MPH on top.
Click to expand...
122 mph what track size you have
 
Brian Friebel said:
I assume your orange primary spring is from TP. How do you like it verses the stocker. I just put the TP secondary spring in @50 I was told you have to change weights on the primary to get the orange primary spring to perform like it was designed to. Truth to that or? Did you lose any rpm with orange primary spring? Forgive my question if dumb. I am a newbie trying to pick up all the info I can.
Click to expand...
The short easy to install orange primary spring has nice smooth 2700-2800 engagement with 2 glide washers and 1 shim. The rate is higher than stock but it performs well for me. It seems to help the slightly lazy stock clutching especially while breaking in. If anything I gained a couple of hundred RPMS using this spring with the orange secondary spring.It runs 8800-8900 now. Once I tune I will probably go to the heavy hitters.
 
fourload said:
The short easy to install orange primary spring has nice smooth 2700-2800 engagement with 2 glide washers and 1 shim. The rate is higher than stock but it performs well for me. It seems to help the slightly lazy stock clutching especially while breaking in. If anything I gained a couple of hundred RPMS using this spring with the orange secondary spring.It runs 8800-8900 now. Once I tune I will probably go to the heavy hitters.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info I have glide washers now on the stock spring. I think I will give the orange spring a try.
 
I have the Thunder Products big venom kit in my primary and had the orange secondary @3-3 and 33/35 helix. It performed well but I noticed high clutch and belt temps. (touching with my hand) I went back to the stock 35 helix and installed the Dalton Black/Orange secondary spring @ 6-1. I like this better as the belt and clutch temps are now cool. The back shifting is less and there is no engine braking but overall I like the way it performs. It feels like it upshifts much quicker and really pulls hard in the mid range.
 
q
STAIN said:
The stock Sidewinder helix is 35 degrees. It matches the flat profile of the primary weight. The ramp is very long and the helix moves a long way during shift out. When you install a stiffer spring, the helix moves so much that stiff spring really gets wound making it stiffer still. By taking a dual angle helix such as in my case a 45-41., the ramp is much sorter letting the stock spring to work as designed.
When choosing the helix angle for my SW, Mr. Lessard took into consideration the profile of the primary weight I was using. He then chose the helix angle to match the shift profile of the weights.
When you run a super stiff secondary spring, you slow or hold the shift of the secondary and loose clutch efficiency creating heat. You are using engine power to open the clutch instead of using power to move the sled forward. You want the primary and secondary shift rates to MATCH each other, not fight each other.
It seems that a lot of people here are clutching sleds for the first time, which is great. I love trying to make the clutches on my sleds work perfectly, it is half the fun of snowmobiling to me. BUT, remember that with the power of these Sidewinders it is easy to mask clutching inefficiency's. These sled will power right through some improper set ups. Try setting up a 60hp sled first , where every little change can be felt, good and bad.
Don't copy some one else's set ups, use them as a reference . Try things your self and get the sled to drive the way you want it to drive.

For what is worth, the world fastest sled uses a stock Apex secondary............
Click to expand...
question with your 45-41 to you use stock secondary spring? and how much tension? thks
 
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