nate007
Lifetime Member
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2006
- Messages
- 2,770
- Location
- Iowa City, Iowa
- Country
- USA
- Snowmobile
- 1. '06 Apex -twin screw
2. '04 Redline Revolt 800
3. '09 Nytro XTX - twin screw
All the issues aside, and if it's a good thing to protect the trails, I agree something needs to be changed, but my argument wasn't with the noise rules, its with the blanket "no-modification" rules.
It's not hard for anyone to see that the snowmobile industry and it's riders take alot more grief than many other vehicles.
I live approximately a mile off an interstate, and in a residential development, in town. I also am very familiar with, and have the clowns with uber-loud 2 strokes that rip right through my side yard, 20 feet from my house (I live on a corner). When Dumb and Dumber scream through my yard blipping their throttls constantly at 3 AM it does get my attention, but their noise over as fast as it arrived. I can however, hear the huge packs of loud motorcycles roaring up and down the interstate for miles, and even over any truck traffic. Nobody complains about a loud motorcycle from miles away? My point isn't arguing that loud pipes are ok, because if it truly bothers someone enough to upset them (more-so than any other noises of everyday life) then yes, regulate the noise. I've never heard of anybody regulating the jerk-wad up the street from me with his Soft-tail Deuce with drag pipes on it flying by my house doing 45 in a 25mph zone? He gets away with it almost year-round?
So at what point does anybody tell the thousands of Harley guys they can't buy anything aftermarket for exhaust? Can anyone imagine how well that would go over? I personally haven't owned a Harley, and have no issues with them, and would buy one as well, so don't think I'm a hater by any means. I'm a hot rod guy for a living, so noisy stuff is my life! For the local government to tell someone they can't buy a commercially available item (that isn't alcohol or firearm related) just isn't right by the letter of that law in and of itself. I agree with the motive, just not the excecution.
I simply oppose "discressionary law enforcement". I'd hope some will agree that a 4 stroke sled is almost always much quieter than a piped 2 stroke, but for the mods I have on my sled, I'd choke it with factory pipes. My exhaust isn't very loud, and when I keep my happy thumb under control, my Cub Cadet lawn tractor is actually louder! Yes I have measured it. Don't know if I trust my cheapo meter, but even my wife could tell the difference when I rode my sled across the yard with my mower running and the blades spinning.
The main reason I've gotten involved with this thread (as foolish as I am) is:
We've been working on an Apex kit for quite some time that sounds completely factory but saves weight, solves mainainence issues and frees up power. As many people who like our Nytro kit, or any other exhaust, I do get tons of feedback from those who do want to keep it quiet, so we've been experimenting with lots of different designs to see what could be done? I guess even though the ear couldn't tell, or the high-mile worn out stocker is louder, I could never sell them anyway?...
Keep things factory when they need to be, in places like Yellowstone, and other "parks", but I wouldn't even be chiming in or sticking my neck out for this lynch mob if the law discussed in this thread were simply enacting decible limit. Heck, if we achieved our goals, I'd be all for it! It'd be better for business. Don't kill private industry with a blanket policy that may not necessarilly be fair.
It's not hard for anyone to see that the snowmobile industry and it's riders take alot more grief than many other vehicles.
I live approximately a mile off an interstate, and in a residential development, in town. I also am very familiar with, and have the clowns with uber-loud 2 strokes that rip right through my side yard, 20 feet from my house (I live on a corner). When Dumb and Dumber scream through my yard blipping their throttls constantly at 3 AM it does get my attention, but their noise over as fast as it arrived. I can however, hear the huge packs of loud motorcycles roaring up and down the interstate for miles, and even over any truck traffic. Nobody complains about a loud motorcycle from miles away? My point isn't arguing that loud pipes are ok, because if it truly bothers someone enough to upset them (more-so than any other noises of everyday life) then yes, regulate the noise. I've never heard of anybody regulating the jerk-wad up the street from me with his Soft-tail Deuce with drag pipes on it flying by my house doing 45 in a 25mph zone? He gets away with it almost year-round?
So at what point does anybody tell the thousands of Harley guys they can't buy anything aftermarket for exhaust? Can anyone imagine how well that would go over? I personally haven't owned a Harley, and have no issues with them, and would buy one as well, so don't think I'm a hater by any means. I'm a hot rod guy for a living, so noisy stuff is my life! For the local government to tell someone they can't buy a commercially available item (that isn't alcohol or firearm related) just isn't right by the letter of that law in and of itself. I agree with the motive, just not the excecution.
I simply oppose "discressionary law enforcement". I'd hope some will agree that a 4 stroke sled is almost always much quieter than a piped 2 stroke, but for the mods I have on my sled, I'd choke it with factory pipes. My exhaust isn't very loud, and when I keep my happy thumb under control, my Cub Cadet lawn tractor is actually louder! Yes I have measured it. Don't know if I trust my cheapo meter, but even my wife could tell the difference when I rode my sled across the yard with my mower running and the blades spinning.
The main reason I've gotten involved with this thread (as foolish as I am) is:
We've been working on an Apex kit for quite some time that sounds completely factory but saves weight, solves mainainence issues and frees up power. As many people who like our Nytro kit, or any other exhaust, I do get tons of feedback from those who do want to keep it quiet, so we've been experimenting with lots of different designs to see what could be done? I guess even though the ear couldn't tell, or the high-mile worn out stocker is louder, I could never sell them anyway?...
Keep things factory when they need to be, in places like Yellowstone, and other "parks", but I wouldn't even be chiming in or sticking my neck out for this lynch mob if the law discussed in this thread were simply enacting decible limit. Heck, if we achieved our goals, I'd be all for it! It'd be better for business. Don't kill private industry with a blanket policy that may not necessarilly be fair.
nate007
Lifetime Member
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2006
- Messages
- 2,770
- Location
- Iowa City, Iowa
- Country
- USA
- Snowmobile
- 1. '06 Apex -twin screw
2. '04 Redline Revolt 800
3. '09 Nytro XTX - twin screw
On a side note to all this, wer're looking into a sticky somewhere on the forum that will list current rules and regulations for various areas.
I know there are many different regulations for different states and riding conditions, so I looked up what the laws are for my state and found one I don't think anyone around here knew about, nor has anyone I've talked to recently around here...
There is aparently a noise law in Iowa, and it states that a sled cannot be any louder than 89 decibles measured from 50 feet away, but make no mention of "no-modofications". (I'd be screwed if that was the case...) I also talked to one of our county's deputies just tonight (they stop by my shop quite a bit when I'm working late) and asked him about it. He said none of the officers, nor the DNR officers he's aware of carry equipmet to even measure decibles! He also noted that he has never heard of a noise complaint, but has quickly flashed his lights at some sledders who were "mis-behaving" while riding along a highway, and they quickly got inline and settled down.
Some years are better than others, and our snow can be spotty sometimes, so when there is barely enough to ride, there are hundreds of them out. Most of the towns have chosen to enforce curfews as an answer to the noise laws, ranging from 10pm to 11 pm. I have heard of people getting parked if caught riding through town(s) too late. I've have been stopped after curfew before, but after explaining that I'm on my way home and returning from a long cross country ride, the officer didn't harrass me any further since I wasn't screwing around and wasn't drinking. He just happened to be at an intersection when I was passing thorough, alone, and riding well under the speed limit to keep things quiet...
There are alternatives to arbitrary rulings. Having sensitive landowners request extra signs indicating "no-noise", post a speed limit, or "stay on the trails or lose them", both of which I have seen around here, and have yet to see someone leave tracks off the trail. I do think most landowners who are willing to allow trails to pass through are reasonable people who don't hate sledders. Get involved with your club and help communicate with those people to help do everything possible to see that their needs are met! Satisfied landowners make happy sledders...
I know there are many different regulations for different states and riding conditions, so I looked up what the laws are for my state and found one I don't think anyone around here knew about, nor has anyone I've talked to recently around here...
There is aparently a noise law in Iowa, and it states that a sled cannot be any louder than 89 decibles measured from 50 feet away, but make no mention of "no-modofications". (I'd be screwed if that was the case...) I also talked to one of our county's deputies just tonight (they stop by my shop quite a bit when I'm working late) and asked him about it. He said none of the officers, nor the DNR officers he's aware of carry equipmet to even measure decibles! He also noted that he has never heard of a noise complaint, but has quickly flashed his lights at some sledders who were "mis-behaving" while riding along a highway, and they quickly got inline and settled down.
Some years are better than others, and our snow can be spotty sometimes, so when there is barely enough to ride, there are hundreds of them out. Most of the towns have chosen to enforce curfews as an answer to the noise laws, ranging from 10pm to 11 pm. I have heard of people getting parked if caught riding through town(s) too late. I've have been stopped after curfew before, but after explaining that I'm on my way home and returning from a long cross country ride, the officer didn't harrass me any further since I wasn't screwing around and wasn't drinking. He just happened to be at an intersection when I was passing thorough, alone, and riding well under the speed limit to keep things quiet...
There are alternatives to arbitrary rulings. Having sensitive landowners request extra signs indicating "no-noise", post a speed limit, or "stay on the trails or lose them", both of which I have seen around here, and have yet to see someone leave tracks off the trail. I do think most landowners who are willing to allow trails to pass through are reasonable people who don't hate sledders. Get involved with your club and help communicate with those people to help do everything possible to see that their needs are met! Satisfied landowners make happy sledders...
Beenba
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Good right up.
Just remember, that this law is just like many other laws that just get ignored and rarely enforced. I highly doubt if your doing 55 through the trails, driving peacefully, minding your own business, a cop isn't going to pull you over just for your pipe.
He will pull you over when your speeding, passing, revving, jumping...and then the pipe ticket is just a bonus for him! Or he will use it to threaten you more once you try and give him a hard time!
Just remember, that this law is just like many other laws that just get ignored and rarely enforced. I highly doubt if your doing 55 through the trails, driving peacefully, minding your own business, a cop isn't going to pull you over just for your pipe.
He will pull you over when your speeding, passing, revving, jumping...and then the pipe ticket is just a bonus for him! Or he will use it to threaten you more once you try and give him a hard time!
canoehead
TY 4 Stroke God
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2011
- Messages
- 2,136
- Location
- NE, Alberta
- Country
- Canada
- Snowmobile
- 2014 XF9000, 2016 Viper XTX
In Edmonton Alberta they have incorporated a bylaw pointed directly at Harley Riders. No pipes allowed!! They can kiss my Vance & Hines right on the shiny spot!!!
mach9
TY 4 Stroke Master
It's a good thing I got my nytro running cooler with vented hood etc.
I don't need to go off trail anymore looking for loose snow.
I can see the headlines now!
**Overheating Yamaha Snowmobiles to Blame for Trail Closures.**
I don't need to go off trail anymore looking for loose snow.
I can see the headlines now!
**Overheating Yamaha Snowmobiles to Blame for Trail Closures.**
revster
TY 4 Stroke God
- Joined
- Aug 18, 2004
- Messages
- 1,752
- Location
- La Salle MB
- Country
- Canada
- Snowmobile
- 2009 Yamaha Nytro RTX SE
Beenba said:Good right up.
Just remember, that this law is just like many other laws that just get ignored and rarely enforced. I highly doubt if your doing 55 through the trails, driving peacefully, minding your own business, a cop isn't going to pull you over just for your pipe.
He will pull you over when your speeding, passing, revving, jumping...and then the pipe ticket is just a bonus for him! Or he will use it to threaten you more once you try and give him a hard time!
I agree. There is a difference between the laws on paper and common practice. We have similar noise laws in MB to what most people have however there is not a lot of enforcement going on. As long as there are no complaints coming in, they leave the sledders alone. Last year was the first year I had ever been checked on the trail. They checked that I had a trail pass that was it.
If someone is seen as being the type of person causing the complaint as Beenba descried, then the dust might get blown of the old off road vehicles act and the tags would start flowin'.
Lets just all do our part to respect residential areas, we can't control the idiots out there that are buzzing the tower.
I see dubs all the time pull off their helmet, then pull out their ear plugs. That says it all huh....
Zakre
TY 4 Stroke Guru
vector06 said:
I am assuming you meant "dudes" not dubs? Dubs to me means 20 inch wheels or A&W burgers lol!
I like to hear a sled coming from more than 2 seconds gives me time to get outta the way on the trail if I am stopped for whatever reason. It doesn't have to be stupid loud but at a slow pace you can barely hear them coming with a helmet on and BAM 4 sleds on top of you GTF Otta the way!
I have the excell header, k&n's and MBRP can and have been through 4 checks so far without issues, as long as i drive up like a human there are no issues. I do let me buddies start their sleds up first just in cases lol.
Zrxpilot
Pro
I married into a family that has a trail crossing nearly 200 acres of our land. I for one could care less about noisy pipes. Nobody else in my family gives a rats patooey either.
What we do care about is the guys that ride off trail. Our fear is that they will hit something like a big rock or take out a fence and get seriously injured and then try to sue us. You would like to think that wouldnt happen but you never know.
Ive even had a few sleds end up in my back yard thats over a 1/8 mile off trail. Freaks out the horses and cant imagine what would happen if they wandered into the buffallo pasture and got stuck.
What we do care about is the guys that ride off trail. Our fear is that they will hit something like a big rock or take out a fence and get seriously injured and then try to sue us. You would like to think that wouldnt happen but you never know.
Ive even had a few sleds end up in my back yard thats over a 1/8 mile off trail. Freaks out the horses and cant imagine what would happen if they wandered into the buffallo pasture and got stuck.
