OW40 oil

[stevewithOCD]

I bet most are on to a new sled by 5k miles. So in the end who are you doing all this maintenance for? The next guy? LoL.

I think most of us are doing a serious over-kill, but there is no harm in doing a good job.
We've ALL been burnt in our lives with others doing shoddy work on one thing or the other.
Because we are on this site, most likely we are doing the work ourselves. So we spend a couple extra shillings & go beyond what we need to do.
With ALL the things that can go wrong with snowmobiling, this is the one thing i've never worried about. Snowmobiling is Murphy's Law times 10.

As the great local poet once said:

"It is never wrong to do the Right thing"
MARK TWAIN

 

[geez150]

I agree, as I have been burnt by sub par work. I guess it just makes me lol with all the above and beyond worry and work many are doing just to dump the sled in two years. To me doing all the prep work and ocd stuff is for a sled that a guy is going to keep for the long haul. But to each their own, I have done many of the mods and maintenance suggested by many on here with good results and will be going into my 4th season with this sled.

 

[Fast]

I drain both hoses without removing the panel. I've never had any luck with rivnuts!

Does the oil tank/chain case cover come off easy without removing the bottom plastic panel

 

[ApexXTX/Viper]

Does the oil tank/chain case cover come off easy without removing the bottom plastic panel

Once all oil is drained and all hoses, wires and reverse actuator removed, it's not that bad. I use small bungee cords to hold the actuator assembly and muffler spring back. With the screw securing the panel to the footrest removed, there's more than enough room for removal.

 

[swampcat]

Does the oil tank/chain case cover come off easy without removing the bottom plastic panel

Come off, yes. Easy NO. Do yourself a HUGE favor and pull the plastic piece and rivnut it back on.

 

[ROCKERDAN]

I agree, as I have been burnt by sub par work. I guess it just makes me lol with all the above and beyond worry and work many are doing just to dump the sled in two years. To me doing all the prep work and ocd stuff is for a sled that a guy is going to keep for the long haul. But to each their own, I have done many of the mods and maintenance suggested by many on here with good results and will be going into my 4th season with this sled.

I would not want to buy a sled from you....lol

One thing I've found over the years, my sleds always are wanted by most everyone I know. As they know I am OCD about my sleds and like doing things right. It makes no difference to me if Im keeping it or selling it. And in the end, i tend to want new iron every 2 seasons.

For me its not just about riding, its a hobby where I enjoy the wrenching/modding just as much as riding. If a sled has poor engineering, i want to fix those shortcomings regardless if I keep or move on.

Dan

 

[stevewithOCD]

I would not want to buy a sled from you....lol

One thing I've found over the years, my sleds always are wanted by most everyone I know. As they know I am OCD about my sleds and like doing things right. It makes no difference to me if Im keeping it or selling it. And in the end, i tend to want new iron every 2 seasons.

For me its not just about riding, its a hobby where I enjoy the wrenching/modding just as much as riding. If a sled has poor engineering, i want to fix those shortcomings regardless if I keep or move on.

Dan

And you'd feel OK selling it to a friend

 

[Hammer70]

Do you really think that Yamaha is going to warrant your sled for 20 years if you are doing the service? Most of us trail riders will not notice the difference between weights in the oil. Drag racers might. I use Penzoil ultra 5/30 Yamaha filters. Next debate will likely be who's gas is the best.

X2

 

[Fast]

Not enough cleaning agents in racing oil. TBN is not high enough to go any distance. You don’t want to use racing oil in anything you are not constantly changing oil in. Just because it says racing does not make it good oil either. There are many racing oils that are less than adequate out there.

Bob is the oil guy, and and rat540 websites will provide much information.

Hey Mike way off topic but did you ever have a chance to race Tiina or Kiersten Duncanson? I was currious if they were in the same category you were i seem to remember Stach's yamaha 4 running in the low 8's and thought thats what Tiina was running

 

[Teamblue4]

I bet most are on to a new sled by 5k miles. So in the end who are you doing all this maintenance for? The next guy? LoL.

11,000 miles on my 2012 Apex, oil and filter changed every season and still counting,

 

[Turboflash]

Below is from same 540 Rat article RockerDan posted. If you go to full length article, below is from section 8 where he cites actual data and compares 0W40 vs 5W30 vs 0W30.

From a wear protection standpoint the 5W-30 oils he tested were all better than the 0W-40s. I'm using 5W-30 Mobil 1 (the Pennzoil Ultra is hard to find otherwise I'd be using that). And, as KnappAttack says, not only do you get better wear protection from the 5W-30 but also less HP loss due to pumping losses vs. 0W-40.

8. 0W40 vs 5W30 vs 0W30

On the Corvette C6, Z06 Forum, perhaps the most popular oil the U.S. guys like to use is what they call, the 0W40 Euro blend Mobil 1. This oil is what GM calls for in the Owner’s Manual and also on the oil filler cap on C6 Z06’s sold in Canada and Europe, whereas 5W30 Mobil 1 is called for in the U.S. The rationale the U.S. Corvette owners typically use for choosing this 0W40 Euro blend Mobil 1 instead of following GM’s recommendation, is the thinking that this oil may have more zinc than U.S. oil, and their mistaken belief that more zinc and a higher viscosity can provide better wear protection, as well as their mistaken belief that 5W30 Mobil 1 is not very good.

Also, on “Bob is the Oil Guy” Forum, 0W30 Castrol Edge with Syntec (black bottle), API SL, European Formula, made in Germany and sold in the U.S., is very popular. This is apparently because they favor the better cold flowing 0W cold viscosity rating (which is a good idea), and because of the thinking that this oil may have more zinc than U.S. oil, and their mistaken belief that more zinc can provide better wear protection.

The Z06 guys as well as the Bob Forum guys, obviously feel this way based on emotion and guessing/speculation, because they clearly never had any test data to evaluate………………until now.

All this calls for performing Engineering Wear Protection testing those 0W40 and 5W30 Corvette Z06 oils, as well as testing 0W30 oils, to see how they all compare. Then Z06 owners and the Bob Forum guys can take a look at actual hard test data numbers that will show the facts. With that information in hand, they can make an informed decision when it comes to selecting an oil that will truly provide them with the best wear protection.

So, I tested the following motor oils:

0W40 and 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra

0W40, 5W30 and 0W30 Mobil 1

0W40, 5W30 and 0W30 Castrol Edge with Syntec (in the black bottle)

NOTE: Castrol’s top of the line 100% Edge motor oil, comes in the gold bottle.

The Wear Protection reference categories are:

• Over 105,000 psi = INCREDIBLE wear protection

• 90,000 to 105,000 psi = OUTSTANDING wear protection

• 75,000 to 90,000 psi = GOOD wear protection

• 60,000 to 75,000 psi = MODEST wear protection

• Below 60,000 psi = UNDESIRABLE wear protection

Here is how these oils ranked just among themselves, according to their Wear Protection Capability. All wear protection capability testing was performed at 230* F, and the higher the psi value, the better the wear protection. I also included values for the onset of thermal breakdown for comparison (the thermal breakdown values were rounded to the nearest 5* increment):

1. 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra, API SM synthetic = 115,612 psi, which puts it in the INCREDIBLE wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 280* F

2. 5W30 Mobil 1, API SN synthetic = 105,875 psi, which puts it in the INCREDIBLE wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 265* F

3. 5W30 Castrol Edge w/Syntec, API SN (black bottle, formerly Castrol Syntec) synthetic = 85,179 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = TBD (I did not test this particular oil for this when I had it on hand)

4. 0W40 Mobil 1, API SN, European Formula, made in the U.S., synthetic = 82,644 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 285* F

5. 0W40 Pennzoil Ultra, API SN, synthetic = 81,863 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 260* F

6. 0W30 Mobil 1, API SN, Advanced Fuel Economy, synthetic = 81,240 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 290* F

7. 0W40 Castrol Edge with Syntec (black bottle), API SN, European Formula, made in Belgium and sold in the U.S., synthetic = 69,307 psi, which puts it in the MODEST wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 290* F

8. 0W30 Castrol Edge with Syntec (black bottle), API SL, European Formula, made in Germany and sold in the U.S., synthetic = 69,302 psi, which puts it in the MODEST wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 290* F

As you can see from these actual Engineering test values, all the 5W30 oils provide better wear protection than any of the 0W oils. But even so, any of these oils would be acceptable for normal daily driver use. However, for highly loaded High Performance applications where the best possible wear protection is desired, the obvious choice would be 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra, API SM or 5W30 Mobil 1, API SN, which are the only oils in this test that provide INCREDIBLE wear protection.

So, GM got it right about which oil to recommend in their U.S. Z06 Corvette’s. One can only speculate that perhaps they expect the U.S. cars to be run harder, so they call for the best protection in those engines. Although, general availability in Canada and Europe may also play a part in what oil they recommend. Whatever the case, both oil viscosities had to meet GM’s endurance testing requirements.

Folks can of course decide for themselves which oil they want to run in their own cars. But now, they have the accurate test data to make an informed decision.

NOTE: After this piece was originally written, 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra, API “SM” has been phased out and replaced TWICE by a newer API “SN” version. See the Wear Protection Ranking List in Section 1, for the current psi value and ranking position.

540 RAT

.

 

[jonlafon1]

Nice info 540 rat. Just purchased a 19 Ram that calls for this pennzoil ultra platinum. They call for it in the Hellcat motor. I don’t know a lot but after researching this pennzoil it’s the goods! Your little write up caught my attention.

 

[ClutchMaster]

Below is from same 540 Rat article RockerDan posted. If you go to full length article, below is from section 8 where he cites actual data and compares 0W40 vs 5W30 vs 0W30.

From a wear protection standpoint the 5W-30 oils he tested were all better than the 0W-40s. I'm using 5W-30 Mobil 1 (the Pennzoil Ultra is hard to find otherwise I'd be using that). And, as KnappAttack says, not only do you get better wear protection from the 5W-30 but also less HP loss due to pumping losses vs. 0W-40.

8. 0W40 vs 5W30 vs 0W30

On the Corvette C6, Z06 Forum, perhaps the most popular oil the U.S. guys like to use is what they call, the 0W40 Euro blend Mobil 1. This oil is what GM calls for in the Owner’s Manual and also on the oil filler cap on C6 Z06’s sold in Canada and Europe, whereas 5W30 Mobil 1 is called for in the U.S. The rationale the U.S. Corvette owners typically use for choosing this 0W40 Euro blend Mobil 1 instead of following GM’s recommendation, is the thinking that this oil may have more zinc than U.S. oil, and their mistaken belief that more zinc and a higher viscosity can provide better wear protection, as well as their mistaken belief that 5W30 Mobil 1 is not very good.

Also, on “Bob is the Oil Guy” Forum, 0W30 Castrol Edge with Syntec (black bottle), API SL, European Formula, made in Germany and sold in the U.S., is very popular. This is apparently because they favor the better cold flowing 0W cold viscosity rating (which is a good idea), and because of the thinking that this oil may have more zinc than U.S. oil, and their mistaken belief that more zinc can provide better wear protection.

The Z06 guys as well as the Bob Forum guys, obviously feel this way based on emotion and guessing/speculation, because they clearly never had any test data to evaluate………………until now.

All this calls for performing Engineering Wear Protection testing those 0W40 and 5W30 Corvette Z06 oils, as well as testing 0W30 oils, to see how they all compare. Then Z06 owners and the Bob Forum guys can take a look at actual hard test data numbers that will show the facts. With that information in hand, they can make an informed decision when it comes to selecting an oil that will truly provide them with the best wear protection.

So, I tested the following motor oils:

0W40 and 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra

0W40, 5W30 and 0W30 Mobil 1

0W40, 5W30 and 0W30 Castrol Edge with Syntec (in the black bottle)

NOTE: Castrol’s top of the line 100% Edge motor oil, comes in the gold bottle.

The Wear Protection reference categories are:

• Over 105,000 psi = INCREDIBLE wear protection

• 90,000 to 105,000 psi = OUTSTANDING wear protection

• 75,000 to 90,000 psi = GOOD wear protection

• 60,000 to 75,000 psi = MODEST wear protection

• Below 60,000 psi = UNDESIRABLE wear protection

Here is how these oils ranked just among themselves, according to their Wear Protection Capability. All wear protection capability testing was performed at 230* F, and the higher the psi value, the better the wear protection. I also included values for the onset of thermal breakdown for comparison (the thermal breakdown values were rounded to the nearest 5* increment):

1. 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra, API SM synthetic = 115,612 psi, which puts it in the INCREDIBLE wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 280* F

2. 5W30 Mobil 1, API SN synthetic = 105,875 psi, which puts it in the INCREDIBLE wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 265* F

3. 5W30 Castrol Edge w/Syntec, API SN (black bottle, formerly Castrol Syntec) synthetic = 85,179 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = TBD (I did not test this particular oil for this when I had it on hand)

4. 0W40 Mobil 1, API SN, European Formula, made in the U.S., synthetic = 82,644 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 285* F

5. 0W40 Pennzoil Ultra, API SN, synthetic = 81,863 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 260* F

6. 0W30 Mobil 1, API SN, Advanced Fuel Economy, synthetic = 81,240 psi, which puts it in the GOOD wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 290* F

7. 0W40 Castrol Edge with Syntec (black bottle), API SN, European Formula, made in Belgium and sold in the U.S., synthetic = 69,307 psi, which puts it in the MODEST wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 290* F

8. 0W30 Castrol Edge with Syntec (black bottle), API SL, European Formula, made in Germany and sold in the U.S., synthetic = 69,302 psi, which puts it in the MODEST wear protection category.
The onset of thermal breakdown = 290* F

As you can see from these actual Engineering test values, all the 5W30 oils provide better wear protection than any of the 0W oils. But even so, any of these oils would be acceptable for normal daily driver use. However, for highly loaded High Performance applications where the best possible wear protection is desired, the obvious choice would be 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra, API SM or 5W30 Mobil 1, API SN, which are the only oils in this test that provide INCREDIBLE wear protection.

So, GM got it right about which oil to recommend in their U.S. Z06 Corvette’s. One can only speculate that perhaps they expect the U.S. cars to be run harder, so they call for the best protection in those engines. Although, general availability in Canada and Europe may also play a part in what oil they recommend. Whatever the case, both oil viscosities had to meet GM’s endurance testing requirements.

Folks can of course decide for themselves which oil they want to run in their own cars. But now, they have the accurate test data to make an informed decision.

NOTE: After this piece was originally written, 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra, API “SM” has been phased out and replaced TWICE by a newer API “SN” version. See the Wear Protection Ranking List in Section 1, for the current psi value and ranking position.

540 RAT

.

Film strength is only one piece of the puzzle when deciding what oil to use. The fact that increased levels of zinc and phosphorus reduce film strength but still improve wear characteristics is an example of that.
If I ran 5w30 penn ultra in my car i might be lucky to get one pass before the engine exploded.

 

[jonlafon1]

Well now

Film strength is only one piece of the puzzle when deciding what oil to use. The fact that increased levels of zinc and phosphorus reduce film strength but still improve wear characteristics is an example of that.
If I ran 5w30 penn ultra in my car i might be lucky to get one pass before the engine exploded.

well sh%^ I didn’t know we were talking 1000 + hp cars! In that case run some Redline? That tickle your fancy Clutchmaster?

 

[KnappAttack]

There is some outdated stuff posted above from Rat540. Some of those oils are not available anymore like the good Penzzoil Ultra SM with those high ratings, others like 0-40 M1 has been reformulated and has one of the best wear ratings for off the shelf oil. Can read the latest listings here from Rat540. https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/

I'll be mixing 0-40M1 and Quaker State 0-20 to get a 0-30 with the highest rated film strength for a 0-30 weight oil for the Winder. I've wiped cams before and thought high zinc was supposed to be good for high pressures and flat tappets, low and behold its not true at all and the reason I was wiping cam lobes as have others when using high zinc oils. I believe Rat540 has found the key to what really works for oil testing and keeping lobes on cams! I'll be using the highest rated real off the shelf oils from his testing moving forward. Noticed that some of the most expensive and trick "race" oils actually perform the worst in his testing which I have also seen some extremely poor oil samples on in vehicles as well.