sidewinder chain tensioner

[SumpBuster]

I'm doing it's first chaincase service now,1500mi.
One tensioner screw had green loctite and was still snug but not overly tight, the other screw didn't have any loctite and was backed halfway out. I red loctited and tack welded both.

Good catch!

 

[STAIN]

I feel like guys come on and freak out if they don’t do exactly what’s being done on here

This applies to a lot of things. GREAT source of info here, just don't freak out about what you read....

 

[Motorhead]

Old news but here it is again pertaining to the question asked.

Followed the book on sled break in concerning speeds, rpms. Also performed the 500 mile oil changes which included splitting the chain case and inspecting the internals. All looked good so I reassemble and set the chain tension per book( Finger/Hand tight and then back off 1 1/2 turns. I then rode this sled at my non break in way for another 500 or 600 miles. Did my next chain case inspection and oil change at around 1100 miles, and as I checked the chain tension bolt before taking the cover off, I was able to turn it in 2 1/2 - 3 turns I estimate.

My stock 21T gear still showed no wear on that known inner surface, but that loose chain did damage my chaincase, (same spot shown by Cannondale happening to Viper owners). I brought it to my dealers attention and was advised that they had been doing just 1 turn out from their Viper days.
Following year I added a tune and a 22T. Still use that 1 turn out with no more problems, in fact after doing another mid year chaincase inspection last season, all looked good with no visible wear on my 22T which had 2-3K on it.
I started my pre season maintenance this week and hope to have it finalized in 2-3 weeks, so if my 22T is worn I shall shout that out.

So watch out for initial (China Chain) stretch, it occurred only once but it was a doozy, and it won’t occur if you go by the book for motor break in procedures.

Doing my pre season maintenance and a track change out also.
My chain tensioner adjustment bolt was found at 2 turns out. So there goes my theory of initial chain stretch only, I run mine at finger tight with all my might and moving my secondary at same time to insure tight as I can, and then 1 turn out.
My last chaincase inspection was mid season last year. All looked good back then.

No new damage to internal of chain case nub.
22T still has that grey coating on it’s ID portion, still looks new and fits on shaft without any slop. It is the cheap one without oil holes and It has around 4K on it.

Chain tension roller screws are tight but will get welded this time around.

Brake bearing and shaft. Bearing looks good, it gets greased every year. 1.750”
Shaft is not 100% clean and smooth, it looks like it has been very lightly knerled. Measured 3 spots on that OD and got 3 different readings. 1.750 - 1.752- 1.754. Peened it in 4 spots and bearing fits on snug!

Keep a good Eye on those chains, that was my second stretch, but I must say, my last 3 days of riding last season were on trails that were Big and Fast, and we did beat on them every chance we got!!!

All else on the sled looked OK except for rear shock bottom shaft. Shocks came off for a shock refresh by my local shock guru, so great time to check all of the suspension parts.

 

[Turboflash]

Doing my pre season maintenance and a track change out also.
My chain tensioner adjustment bolt was found at 2 turns out. So there goes my theory of initial chain stretch only, I run mine at finger tight with all my might and moving my secondary at same time to insure tight as I can, and then 1 turn out.
My last chaincase inspection was mid season last year. All looked good back then.

No new damage to internal of chain case nub.
22T still has that grey coating on it’s ID portion, still looks new and fits on shaft without any slop. It is the cheap one without oil holes and It has around 4K on it.

Chain tension roller screws are tight but will get welded this time around.

Brake bearing and shaft. Bearing looks good, it gets greased every year. 1.750”
Shaft is not 100% clean and smooth, it looks like it has been very lightly knerled. Measured 3 spots on that OD and got 3 different readings. 1.750 - 1.752- 1.754. Peened it in 4 spots and bearing fits on snug!

Keep a good Eye on those chains, that was my second stretch, but I must say, my last 3 days of riding last season were on trails that were Big and Fast, and we did beat on them every chance we got!!!

All else on the sled looked OK except for rear shock bottom shaft. Shocks came off for a shock refresh by my local shock guru, so great time to check all of the suspension parts.

I'm sure you know this but that track shaft bearing (when it's new) measures 1.7716" (45 mm). So, if you measured your shaft and it was 1.750 to 1.754" that means you've got at least .017" clearance. A new shaft measures only .001 to .002" smaller than bearing (I just got a new bearing and shaft under warranty). Your shaft is worn at least .015". Unfortunately for most SW & TCat owners, this is a very common and very familiar problem.
I wonder how well peening stands up over time and miles? IDK. IMO, eventually, you will need a new track shaft (or rebuild old one) like all the rest of us as eventually you may not be able to peen it enough. I do also wonder about shaft strength as the diameter gets smaller and smaller (shaft is hollow).
Best regards.

 

[Motorhead]

Warranty criteria concerning shaft?
Does it need to be gouged or grooved before they cover?

Shall give the dealer a call tomorrow concerning.

 

[Turboflash]

I've heard many different experiences with dealers on this issue.
Your shaft is, without doubt worn down undeniably demonstrating the shaft has been spinning inside bearing. All they have to do is measure both bearing and shaft and it's obvious. Some dealers choose to deny and acknowledge the problem EVEN THOUGH THEY ALL HAVE BEEN TOLD ABOUT IT BY CAT). If your dealer chooses to deny the issue, continue to press them and refuse to accept their response.
Your shaft is "gouged" and "worn down."
I just went through this with my dealer and was "awarded" warranty by Cat in Thief River. They know all about this problem. It's happening to many thousands of sleds!

 

[snowbeast]

I'm sure you know this but that track shaft bearing (when it's new) measures 1.7716" (45 mm). So, if you measured your shaft and it was 1.750 to 1.754" that means you've got at least .017" clearance. A new shaft measures only .001 to .002" smaller than bearing (I just got a new bearing and shaft under warranty). Your shaft is worn at least .015". Unfortunately for most SW & TCat owners, this is a very common and very familiar problem.
I wonder how well peening stands up over time and miles? IDK. IMO, eventually, you will need a new track shaft (or rebuild old one) like all the rest of us as eventually you may not be able to peen it enough. I do also wonder about shaft strength as the diameter gets smaller and smaller (shaft is hollow).
Best regards.

Got my new shaft from woody,s in maine,he removed my old drivers and reinstalled them on new warrentied shaft,brand new shaft to new bearing still had .006 thou fit to each part,so on reinstallment,we drilled tapped and installed one set screw,and ran well all last season,w/no problems,if you only had .001 fit you would need to press the bearing onto shaft.

 

[snowbeast]

Warranty criteria concerning shaft?
Does it need to be gouged or grooved before they cover?

Shall give the dealer a call tomorrow concerning.

Dennis woody did my shaft last year will it still had warrenty,and still with new shaft and bearing,they had -.006 thou slip fit,and was ok,but I did the tap and set screw mod.

 

[Motorhead]

Dennis woody did my shaft last year will it still had warrenty,and still with new shaft and bearing,they had -.006 thou slip fit,and was ok,but I did the tap and set screw mod.

Thanks For that info Pete!

 

[Motorhead]

Thanks For that info Pete!

Woodys has been a very good dealer for me and my much needed past warranty items on my Sidewinder!
He’s hit that ball out of the park for me many times over, so we’ll try again!

 

[scooterwj]

Doing my pre season maintenance and a track change out also.
My chain tensioner adjustment bolt was found at 2 turns out. So there goes my theory of initial chain stretch only, I run mine at finger tight with all my might and moving my secondary at same time to insure tight as I can, and then 1 turn out.
My last chaincase inspection was mid season last year. All looked good back then.

No new damage to internal of chain case nub.
22T still has that grey coating on it’s ID portion, still looks new and fits on shaft without any slop. It is the cheap one without oil holes and It has around 4K on it.

Chain tension roller screws are tight but will get welded this time around.

Brake bearing and shaft. Bearing looks good, it gets greased every year. 1.750”
Shaft is not 100% clean and smooth, it looks like it has been very lightly knerled. Measured 3 spots on that OD and got 3 different readings. 1.750 - 1.752- 1.754. Peened it in 4 spots and bearing fits on snug!

Keep a good Eye on those chains, that was my second stretch, but I must say, my last 3 days of riding last season were on trails that were Big and Fast, and we did beat on them every chance we got!!!

All else on the sled looked OK except for rear shock bottom shaft. Shocks came off for a shock refresh by my local shock guru, so great time to check all of the suspension parts.

My understanding is that there should be some slop between the chain tension screw and the spring tensioner itself.... If I'm reading this correctly you probably have no slop and in fact have the bolt doing quite a bit of the work?

 

[Turboflash]

I believe that's the design intent although I have often thought the spring should be a little stiffer.

 

[Motorhead]

My understanding is that there should be some slop between the chain tension screw and the spring tensioner itself.... If I'm reading this correctly you probably have no slop and in fact have the bolt doing quite a bit of the work?

No, the problem is cheap China made chain whereas this occurred when stock and between 500 and 1100 miles the first time, during the first season of owning this sled. Spring tensioner could have much more spring force to help keep the chain tight once it stretches without your knowing of course!
I did look at mine when cover was off to see what kind of difference 1 or 1.5 feels and looks like!

When it goes back together I shall let you know how much more force that 1/2 turn makes!

 

[STAIN]

My understanding is that there should be some slop between the chain tension screw and the spring tensioner itself.... If I'm reading this correctly you probably have no slop and in fact have the bolt doing quite a bit of the work?

NO!!! search these forums and you will see that over tightening causes other problems. The spec is there for a reason.

 

[Motorhead]

NO!!! search these forums and you will see that over tightening causes other problems. The spec is there for a reason.

Yes I have heard that but the real problem for me has been chain stretching, and if and when it does, you are better off with the 1 turn out. Why?
I found my adjuster at 2 this time around, if I had been at 1.5 with a weak finger tight, more internal damage would have occurred! My 2 cents, plus dealer who has backed my warranty issues 100% also prefers my method. Will you?

Just dropped off my shaft and caliper with bearing still in it. Yep 100% warranty, was told to use locktite when I reassemble whereas all new parts will not keep it from happening again. Thanks all for pushing me that way instead of my alternative solution!

Did get to try the new bearing on the new shaft. It goes on very snug without any kind of wiggle allowed but it can be taken off by hand even though a very snug fit. Thus locktite it will get.