Off Trail Mike
Gone Riding!
Beeze:
I started with 6-1/2 turns on the adjuster from the fully forward position to where I thought tension should be. Ran it for a while and no issues, aside from the single hyfax that partially wore, but that was likely more a lack of scratchers. My buddy suggested the track was too tight and this might be part of the vibration problem I was encountering. Backed it off to 4-1/2 turns and the track is slack. So slack that I replaced the hyfax without taking the tension off the track!
140km's of trail and 50km's in the powder yesterday. No ratcheting whatsoever.....and no slder wear thanks to the scratchers going on.
I didn't measure it but I'd say with the track off the ground and just gravity (no weight on the track), I have at least and 1-1/4" between track and hyfax.
I think you called it right. My skid is very close to the drivers as is the case when setting up the 153's because there isn't much room to make it fit. Hope it works out.
OTM
BTW. Nice pic in the trees!
I started with 6-1/2 turns on the adjuster from the fully forward position to where I thought tension should be. Ran it for a while and no issues, aside from the single hyfax that partially wore, but that was likely more a lack of scratchers. My buddy suggested the track was too tight and this might be part of the vibration problem I was encountering. Backed it off to 4-1/2 turns and the track is slack. So slack that I replaced the hyfax without taking the tension off the track!
140km's of trail and 50km's in the powder yesterday. No ratcheting whatsoever.....and no slder wear thanks to the scratchers going on.
I didn't measure it but I'd say with the track off the ground and just gravity (no weight on the track), I have at least and 1-1/4" between track and hyfax.
I think you called it right. My skid is very close to the drivers as is the case when setting up the 153's because there isn't much room to make it fit. Hope it works out.
OTM
BTW. Nice pic in the trees!
Alatalo
TY 4 Stroke Master
Last fall I purchased the Yamaha Lightweight Rear Suspension Kit. Rumors on this forum say this kit is manufactured by BDX (confirmed rumor) and also that this kit is an identical copy of their CrMo Float kit for the Arctic Cat skid (not confirmed rumor). I purchased this kit because I liked what I heard about the behaviour of the Arctic Cat skid. My plan was to install it in time for this season, but I ended up never installing it because I was less than impressed with the modification needed to move the front swingarm to tunnel mounting point. Basically, the internal strengthening plate that connects the tunnel to the cast chassis side is supposed to be cut off, moved forward and then just re-riveted to the tunnel. In my opinion, this takes away a lot of the strength offered by the internal strengthening plate and this also eliminates the possibility to re-use the stock skid mounting point. In order to perform this modification in a "proper" way that does not lose strength, my plan is to manufacture my own internal strengthening plate. Unfortunately, this will not be ready until later this spring or summer.
Anyway, the following pictures show the recommended mounting points for the Yamaha Lightweight Rear Suspension Kit. In an effort to figure out if this geometry is identical to the Arctic Cat skid, would anybody care to check if these mounting points are somewhat similar to what you are using with the Arctic Cat skid...?
All measurements are center-to-center.
Anyway, the following pictures show the recommended mounting points for the Yamaha Lightweight Rear Suspension Kit. In an effort to figure out if this geometry is identical to the Arctic Cat skid, would anybody care to check if these mounting points are somewhat similar to what you are using with the Arctic Cat skid...?
All measurements are center-to-center.
Attachments
beeze455
Expert
Do these direction show the front arm higher into the tunnel then the stock skid? Looks that way to me.
Alatalo
TY 4 Stroke Master
Yes, according to these directions the mounting point is approximately 7/8" higher and 1 3/4 " forward compared to a standard 2010-2012 MTX SE, when looking at the sled standing on a flat surface. Is this very different compared to what everybody is using with their AC skids...?beeze455 said:
Off Trail Mike
Gone Riding!
Alatalo
My guess is your dimensions are right but are very different from the AC skid and it has to do with the difference between the Yamaha rail and the Arctic Cat rail. The rail raidus on the Yamaha is a long radius, while the radius on the AC is very short.
Also when installing an AC M 153 and 162 skid into a 153/162 nytro, don't use dimensions from a 141 Crossfire going into an XTX, as they are quite different. The 141 Cat skid needs to be set back somewhat since they are using it with the 144 XTX track. The approach angle on the AC crossfire is also steeper by a bit, so they don't share mounting positions.
I did my setup on AutoCAD and made sure that my approach angle was right. If I used your measurements on my 153 AC M skid, there would be two approach angles: One from the track driver to the antistab and another from the antistab to the radius of the rails, in other words, your rail tips would be pushed into the track line. Because you are using the long radius Yamaha rails, your rail tip will be much higher than on my AC rail tip, and it should fit your dimensions.
On my 153 I am 1.33" Forward (X axis) and 1.4" up (Y-Axis) with the rear of the tunnel (highest point) 29" off the ground (at the end of a 153 tunnel) for comparison. I have 1000km's on this setup with no problems and it doesn't ratchet.....ever.... an the track is very slack.
Hope this helps.
OTM
My guess is your dimensions are right but are very different from the AC skid and it has to do with the difference between the Yamaha rail and the Arctic Cat rail. The rail raidus on the Yamaha is a long radius, while the radius on the AC is very short.
Also when installing an AC M 153 and 162 skid into a 153/162 nytro, don't use dimensions from a 141 Crossfire going into an XTX, as they are quite different. The 141 Cat skid needs to be set back somewhat since they are using it with the 144 XTX track. The approach angle on the AC crossfire is also steeper by a bit, so they don't share mounting positions.
I did my setup on AutoCAD and made sure that my approach angle was right. If I used your measurements on my 153 AC M skid, there would be two approach angles: One from the track driver to the antistab and another from the antistab to the radius of the rails, in other words, your rail tips would be pushed into the track line. Because you are using the long radius Yamaha rails, your rail tip will be much higher than on my AC rail tip, and it should fit your dimensions.
On my 153 I am 1.33" Forward (X axis) and 1.4" up (Y-Axis) with the rear of the tunnel (highest point) 29" off the ground (at the end of a 153 tunnel) for comparison. I have 1000km's on this setup with no problems and it doesn't ratchet.....ever.... an the track is very slack.
Hope this helps.
OTM
Alatalo
TY 4 Stroke Master
Quality information...thank you Mike...!
beeze455
Expert
If anybody would like to buy my float skid, please pm me. Looking to get 600 plus shipping.
what are you going to run?
beeze455
Expert
Not sure, but thinking about a timbersled setup. If it does not sell, I may keep messing with the setup. I have tossed the idea around of buying a tunnel too. Going to put on a rev tank and drop the radiator.
Alatalo
TY 4 Stroke Master
Question for OTM and others running AC 153" or 162" skids - does this mounting point end up on the internal strengthening plate (the steel plate that sits inside the tunnel and the cast chassis side)...? If not, how did you solve this...? Mounted only to the aluminum tunnel...? Custom made plate...?Off Trail Mike said:
When I did my fist one I just took the steel plates out, brought them to the water jet and had them make new ones out of 1/4" 5052 and just leave the skid mounting location blank. This made up for the difference in tunnel width, allowed me to mount it wherever I wanted and cut weight
Off Trail Mike
Gone Riding!
Alatalo
One big advantage of the cat skid is the front axle is 1/2" narrower than the stock nytro. This allowed me to tig weld on two small 1/4" (6.35mm) thick gusset plates on the reinforcing plates to make up the difference. I drilled my holes thru these and therefore ended up with a stronger reinforcing plate. With this setup you can put your holes anywhere. You could do the same with the stock setup but you'd have to shorten the shaft a bit, but this is easy.
The other thing I did was to build new outer reinforcing plates out of 1/8" (3mm) stainless plate. With 4 rivets, and stainless plate its much stronger than stock.
I'm probably 6oz's heavier than stock, but bombproof, and that's one weight penalty I can live with.
OTM
One big advantage of the cat skid is the front axle is 1/2" narrower than the stock nytro. This allowed me to tig weld on two small 1/4" (6.35mm) thick gusset plates on the reinforcing plates to make up the difference. I drilled my holes thru these and therefore ended up with a stronger reinforcing plate. With this setup you can put your holes anywhere. You could do the same with the stock setup but you'd have to shorten the shaft a bit, but this is easy.
The other thing I did was to build new outer reinforcing plates out of 1/8" (3mm) stainless plate. With 4 rivets, and stainless plate its much stronger than stock.
I'm probably 6oz's heavier than stock, but bombproof, and that's one weight penalty I can live with.
OTM
Alatalo
TY 4 Stroke Master
Except for the location, that is exactly what I have in mind for the installation of the Lightweight Rear Suspension Kit. As said before, I am not impressed with the instructions included in this kit, which basically tells you to cut the internal strenghtening plate off and re-rivet it in a more forward position...
Off Trail Mike
Gone Riding!
Alatalo
Totally agreed. Butchering the reinforcing plate is stupid. You have to remove the reinforcing plates anyway so its about the same amount of work to cut it up or weld the plates on.
For what it's worth, you might consider trying the whole AC skid vs the the lightweight arms. The advantage is you can switch between the AC skid and Yamaha stock to compare. By simply changing drop brackets. You can see in my second picture, the lower holes are the stock yami holes. The other advantage is if you want to try holz or timbersled, you can search for a used AC or Yami Holz or Timber because you have mounts for both.
My AC skid is around 42 lbs if you delete the idler wheels, and 45 if you keep the idlers up front at the rail radius. Pretty light, and compared to my 09 MTX it floats rather than trenches.
I also have an AC Timbersled skid which I am going to try next season. 25 deg. C for 5 days last week basically liquified our snow. A rather harsh end of the season...
OTM
Totally agreed. Butchering the reinforcing plate is stupid. You have to remove the reinforcing plates anyway so its about the same amount of work to cut it up or weld the plates on.
For what it's worth, you might consider trying the whole AC skid vs the the lightweight arms. The advantage is you can switch between the AC skid and Yamaha stock to compare. By simply changing drop brackets. You can see in my second picture, the lower holes are the stock yami holes. The other advantage is if you want to try holz or timbersled, you can search for a used AC or Yami Holz or Timber because you have mounts for both.
My AC skid is around 42 lbs if you delete the idler wheels, and 45 if you keep the idlers up front at the rail radius. Pretty light, and compared to my 09 MTX it floats rather than trenches.
I also have an AC Timbersled skid which I am going to try next season. 25 deg. C for 5 days last week basically liquified our snow. A rather harsh end of the season...
OTM
Alatalo
TY 4 Stroke Master
I have been looking for one for more than a year, but it seems not too many AC owners (over here) change them out...Off Trail Mike said:
