2020 Release

[DranttelSS]

What?? You mean not everybody wants a sled with turbos, superchargers, 200+ HP, GPS with Bluetooth turn by turn navigation, wireless cellphone charger, and a $3000 electronic controlled shock package that you can control with your thumb and without getting off your sled, Oh sand lets not forget about performance dampeners, heated seats, adjustable ski carbides and adjustable windshields. Throw in a couple extra 12V outlets on the sled to power heated glove, boots, helmet, communicators, 3 GoPros and snowmobile suit. How do people snowmobile without all this stuff? I can't believe my parents let me go out on that 1979 Polaris TX-340 back in the day or why I continue to ride after a few years on my 95 XLT.

I get your point, but honestly sales are better now with these "luxury" sleds than they were before them. Thats in our dealership anyway.

 

[Sasquatch]

My dad used to say: "There are lies, damn lies, and statistics." (in that order.) I looked up Yamaha's "Fact Book" for 2014 and 2015 with write-ups for snowmobile sales in 2013 and 2014 respectively. The reason why they sold 21,000 sleds in 2014 can be summed up in one word, "RUSSIA". According to Yamaha's reports, in 2014, Russia bought 9,000 sleds, or 42.7% of Yamaha snowmobile sales. In 2017, your graphic shows that Russia only bought 1,000 sleds, or 9.8% of Yamaha's sled sales. I don't know why Russia stopped buying Yamahas; maybe because they were built in the U.S.? According to Yamaha's own reports, they only sold 4,000 sleds in the U.S. in both 2013 and 2014. Your graphic shows that they sold 3,000 sleds in the U.S. in 2017. That is a 25% reduction, but 20-25% is consistent with the sales reduction in the entire snowmobile industry during that same time period. By 2017, the vast majority of the 3,000 sleds Yamaha sold had to be Pro Cross chassis sleds, either Vipers or Sidewinders, and let's not forget about all the Arctic Cat 7000 series sleds and Thundercats (Vipers & Sidewinders in AC clothing) sold in 2017. If you added AC's numbers to the 3,000 sleds Yamaha sold in the U.S., I'll bet Yamaha sold more sleds (or sled engines) in 2017 than they did in 2013 or 2014. Let's face it, we know that the delta box sleds and Phazers weren't selling in 2017, otherwise they wouldn't have discontinued them.

Hmmm numbers. You cant add Arctic Cat sleds to Yamaha numbers and then claim they sold more sleds. You could say Cat sold more sleds as they sold them to Yamaha and to themselves. Yep Delta box sales where dismal but lets face it I bought a 2013 and its the same sled as a 2018. Wonder what sleds the Russians where buying?

 

[Sasquatch]

People can't afford all these high priced toys anymore....But don't worry Trudon't will bail them out when the going gets tuff!

Bombardier is totally different them BRP. Two separate companies not related!

 

[Sasquatch]

Whats a Yamah?

 

[murdered141]

Bombardier is totally different them BRP. Two separate companies not related!

So brp ( bombardier recreational products) is not related to bombardier

 

[Sasquatch]

Yup and it’s to both companies advantage to have both survive even if it’s in name only. Why drive customers to Doo or Poo?

I think they already have.

 

[Sasquatch]

So brp ( bombardier recreational products) is not related to bombardier

No!

 

[Sasquatch]

No. I mean a 2st cat motor in Yamaha/Cat along with the 4 st Yamaha motor is for sure but the Yamaha chassis is not a sure thing. So you will be able to buy a 2st or 4st Yamaha next year. If 2st is in Cat chassis it’s just Yamaha name. If in a Yamaha chassis then it’s a hybrid and if Yamaha chassis and 4st it’s a purebred Yamaha!

Cat two stroke sold as a Yamaha is quite possible, more Cat chassis sleds carrying Yamaha engines yep I agree but a all Yamaha sled I think is a pipe dream.

 

[Sasquatch]

There will be speculation until Yamaha makes an announcement then 2021 speculation begins. Lol

As it has since 2006 or so.

 

[Sasquatch]

The reason sleds sales are down isn't just the lack of snow, it's mainly the price of these things now days! They're getting too complicated just like the cars and trucks we drive, turbos and things we don't really need on sleds, that's why they cost so damn much. They need to start making basic 2 stroke sleds again, something without all the bells and whistles. If more people could afford to buy them the sales would go up. Look at that new arctic cat they call an SRX, MSRP is like $17,500, that's not including tax or interest if you take out a loan, I mean....who want's to spend nearly 20 grand on a snowmobile?! lol

Its way over 20,000 dollars in Canada. Now lets talk about those uncomplicated two stroke. They are anything but uncomplicated and to stay around they will become even more complicated. Its the nature of the beast, I long for my old 1986 one ton 4X4, Manual trans, lockable hubs, Manual transfer case, leaf srpring front and rear, no on board computer, carberated, only polution controls was an egr, 20mpg with 4.10 gears and 33 inch tires. Pure simplicity! Easy to work on, reliable and bush proof. What has replaced it is a nightmare to work on and no where as bush proof.

Sleds have and are evolving in the same way. Two strokes of the simple reliable type are the VK 540 type. There is a reason the trappers and fisherman love them. It is a sled though that will not meet emissions and is only still offered because four strokes balance the fleet out.

 

[Sasquatch]

It's true that is expensive, but if you figure inflation it is not really that much of a difference. The 1996 V-max 800 had an MSRP of 9399.00 in todays dollars (according to a google calculator) that equals 15,096.00 so really not a huge difference. But the complexity is much higher, which can make wrenching more intimidating. That being said they are much more reliable and need less wrenching to some degree.

Problem is inflation and the dollar that does not stretch. As everything goes up and wages do not, disposable income shrinks. So what do you cut?

 

[Deeppow16]

Problem is inflation and the dollar that does not stretch. As everything goes up and wages do not, disposable income shrinks. So what do you cut?

This is what a lot of people don't realize. Wages have not kept up to inflation and it most likely never will until the market crashes or theres some major changes. There is a tipping point that the cost of living and consumer goods will get to expensive and it will force a lot of people to quite spending money unless its just for peer necessities(food, housing, etc). If that happens that market will crash again. Prices need to stop increasing otherwise this will happen. Its only a matter of time.

 

[Smokum]

Its way over 20,000 dollars in Canada. Now lets talk about those uncomplicated two stroke. They are anything but uncomplicated and to stay around they will become even more complicated. Its the nature of the beast, I long for my old 1986 one ton 4X4, Manual trans, lockable hubs, Manual transfer case, leaf srpring front and rear, no on board computer, carberated, only polution controls was an egr, 20mpg with 4.10 gears and 33 inch tires. Pure simplicity! Easy to work on, reliable and bush proof. What has replaced it is a nightmare to work on and no where as bush proof.

Sleds have and are evolving in the same way. Two strokes of the simple reliable type are the VK 540 type. There is a reason the trappers and fisherman love them. It is a sled though that will not meet emissions and is only still offered because four strokes balance the fleet out.

I agree 100% with you about the simple old trucks you could work on yourself, but the only way you were getting 20 mpg with that truck with those specs is if it was shut off and coasting down a hill. That was a completely ridiculous thing to claim.

 

[03RX1-ER-LE]

This is what a lot of people don't realize. Wages have not kept up to inflation and it most likely never will until the market crashes or theres some major changes. There is a tipping point that the cost of living and consumer goods will get to expensive and it will force a lot of people to quite spending money unless its just for peer necessities(food, housing, etc). If that happens that market will crash again. Prices need to stop increasing otherwise this will happen. Its only a matter of time.

I will say here in US the signs are starting to show for another reset. It has always been about a ten year cycle as long as I can recall. Housing sales have already slowed here, interest rates have started to increase and like always our salaries have not increased. Hopefully is does not happen until this years sled season is over. I am watching closely, and if it happens what will happen to the already dismal sled sales in the future.

 

[03RX1-ER-LE]

I agree 100% with you about the simple old trucks you could work on yourself, but the only way you were getting 20 mpg with that truck with those specs is if it was shut off and coasting down a hill. That was a completely ridiculous thing to claim.

It could downhill in a tail wind. My 2017 F150 4x4 2.7L EcoBoost gets 22 when not towing, 10 mpg towing. My old carb days of the preclosed loop trucks were 10 mpg and 5 towing.