blown belt issue fixed

[74Nitro]

are the random differences in offset between machines caused by stub shaft walking in and also can someone explain why these come with the secondary non floating. I thought previous secondarys floated where they needed to be

Most manufacturers required a small amount of 'float' so that when you tightened the bolt up, the bearing was not being pushed on the shaft. Skidoo was maybe the first to change this when they put a small step in the jackshaft that the bearing sat against so that the bolt could be tightened with no fear of pushing the bearing. Others here may disagree, but I always want the smallest amount of freeplay possible, if any at all. A properly designed clutch, with proper alignment doesn't need to float The movable sheave is supposed to move, not the entire clutch.

 

[4strokes]

They do float once the belt starts shifting in the driven. push the driven open by hand and let the belts drop down, you'll see it float on the shaft.

haven't looked at mine yet, I take it that the shims at the plug set the belt deflection? been wanting to tighten the belt, but didn't want to open a can of worms at camp, but a shim behind the bolt is easy

 

[cannondale27]

No.
Loose or tight belt deflection isn't going to have any effect on anything if the clutch is engaged on the belt for any reason.

Belt deflection just prevents the belt from rolling the track when idling, and will determine the ratio the sled starts moving at.

Tighter deflection basically lets the sled start in a lower gear as the belt is just a bit higher in the driven, loose deflection and its slipping a bit more on takeoff and in a "higher gear ratio" as the belt is lower in the driven.

Tight belt deflection is better for smooth engagement and taking off in a lower gear. Has no effect on belt durability (unless so tight it burns inside belt on post of drive clutch or is so loose it slips excessively on takeoff) , performance or back shift.

There is a lot of misinformation in this thread, just like every clutch thread on any snowmobile forum.

Although I appreciate the posters desire to let people know what he has done to fix the issue, there is lots to be left to be answered and clarified here. What works for him may not work for another machine and rider.

Ok I understand what you are saying. Yes I agree but IF there is belt whip at decel,No throttle. By setting the belt deflection loose there would be more travel and therefore more time that the secondary is in the act of fully seating and under spring tension/control. Perhaps this slight amount of time is enough to keep up with the primary. I would think this whip is a result of sticking or mismatched components of primary and secondary and is probably not a issue for most but some its very obvious and no way a belt will survive much of that. For anyone to say that Parallelism is the only issue is wrong. Some have more than just the basics wrong. We all have seen the videos.

 

[Lonerider]

All this debate but the root cause of the sidewinder belt failure is misalignment

I can't thank you enough, I think your tool is the most important part of fixing the belt problem. As I ask you in a text message, was 1/2 mm close enough and you replied get it "exact" We did on 2 machines and it works.

 

[74Nitro]

Ok I understand what you are saying. Yes I agree but IF there is belt whip at decel,No throttle. By setting the belt deflection loose there would be more travel and therefore more time that the secondary is in the act of fully seating and under spring tension/control. Perhaps this slight amount of time is enough to keep up with the primary. I would think this whip is a result of sticking or mismatched components of primary and secondary and is probably not a issue for most but some its very obvious and no way a belt will survive much of that. For anyone to say that Parallelism is the only issue is wrong. Some have more than just the basics wrong. We all have seen the videos.

Cannondale, setting the belt deflection loose, has nothing to do with belt deflection while decellerating, throttle closed. Only when the machine comes to a stop does the belt deflection setting take over. Belt 'whip', or I prefer to call it tension, while decellerating is mostly controlled by the secondary,(spring and helix) and a lesser extent the primary.

 

[fatchance]

Let's say belt deflection is set too loose. Wouldn't this allow the belt to climb higher on the primary and possibly bottoming out in the secondary.

 

[cannondale27]

Cannondale, setting the belt deflection loose, has nothing to do with belt deflection while decellerating, throttle closed. Only when the machine comes to a stop does the belt deflection setting take over. Belt 'whip', or I prefer to call it tension, while decellerating is mostly controlled by the secondary,(spring and helix) and a lesser extent the primary.

I know but if deflection is set loose it will take longer for the secondary to get to fully seated. It has too. We are talking milliseconds here. But maybe its enough. I am only bringing this up because the O.P. did and everyone dismissed it. I think it may have some merit.

 

[cannondale27]

Let's say belt deflection is set too loose. Wouldn't this allow the belt to climb higher on the primary and possibly bottoming out in the secondary.

No. Like said its only effect is when belt is disengaged and slight timing effect.

 

[fatchance]

Interesting. I had belt wear and I didn't adjust the deflection to see if it would effect anything. I pulled the belt off after a few long rides and the bottom cogs had burn on them. I figured it had to be due to the loose belt.

 

[snowbeast]

I can say belt wear with the stock 8jp belt is minimum at best,after running belt past 1100 miles with verniers measure .010 belt loss,that is awesome,but what I do see as wear and it cant be measured is spider cracks on the angle of belt sides,these tiny v shaped little cracks,and belt looks glazed or shiney black,no cord wear at all,on most of my old button secondary sleds,you would start a cord tear at top or full shift,until it failed if not replaced and used as a back up.

 

[snowbeast]

when ran with a stock spring, same weight QAY 70 had more top end with a heaver rider. BUT, if you add a green dalton spring it changes everything! you need a lot more weight with it, so DTYA1. Changing the spring we seen 9600 RPMS on the QAY 70"s @ 73 grams. By only changing the spring. So need to add a lot to get the rpm down, one sled runs 119 Dtya-1 the other QAY 70 121, side by side on video, on stock primary spring. Both Sleds way quicker with green spring, at any speed up to 100mph

Are you guys tuned up? I just received my DTYA1,s from Dalton,and tune needs 8900-9100 full shift,now I have 3" muffler and cai,on evo stage 4 tune,do I just start with empty at 73.6 or load tip some,and increase ramp weight,i will run his blk/blue Dalton primary and his 41/35 secondary with either his blk/orange at 60 or TP orange at 50,any info will be good. thanks

 

[mario750]

Too much work, trading them in is easier

I don't know about that .... I was picking up my friends Doo from dealer few weeks ago , and while waiting for paper work I talk to guys that work there and he said that they have turned away at lest 5 customer's whose wanted to trade theirs Winders for 850's this winter.

 

[STAIN]

^^^^^^^BULLSHIT^^^^^^^

 

[**sj**]

If us hardcore riders rode an 850 like the winder...there have been and would be more belt blowers there..

 

[74Nitro]

I don't know about that .... I was picking up my friends Doo from dealer few weeks ago , and while waiting for paper work I talk to guys that work there and he said that they have turned away at lest 5 customer's whose wanted to trade theirs Winders for 850's this winter.

Well, not everyone is brave enough to handle the speed of a turbo.