EPS Conversion?

[74Nitro]

I'm entertaining doing this to my 2019 if this works.
On the change in effort as the machine changes speeds....is it absolutely necessary?
As I understand these power steering units, they are mostly self contained and simpler than most think. I have installed 3 aftermarket kits on SXS's over the years, and there isn't a lot to it.

 

[DMCTurbo]

I'm entertaining doing this to my 2019 if this works.
On the change in effort as the machine changes speeds....is it absolutely necessary?
As I understand these power steering units, they are mostly self contained and simpler than most think. I have installed 3 aftermarket kits on SXS's over the years, and there isn't a lot to it.

I'm interested as well. EPS is the only reason I'd even consider buying a new winder.

 

[Richard Hodgins]

I'm almost done the install right now on my 2019, and I have to say its a real PITA! The voltage regulator needs to be moved to the front bulkhead as opposed to the right side (2 new holes drilled). And 3 holes drilled for the brackets that hold the EPS. I made a template for the holes when I had my old 2022 EPS sled in the shop that is now sold.

But it will work as others have mentioned. I wonder if you just put power to the unit and NOT the CANBUS wires if you would have assist all the time and it not decrease with speed ?

 

[earthling]

I'm almost done the install right now on my 2019, and I have to say its a real PITA! The voltage regulator needs to be moved to the front bulkhead as opposed to the right side (2 new holes drilled). And 3 holes drilled for the brackets that hold the EPS. I made a template for the holes when I had my old 2022 EPS sled in the shop that is now sold.

But it will work as others have mentioned. I wonder if you just put power to the unit and NOT the CANBUS wires if you would have assist all the time and it not decrease with speed ?

That's kind of what makes me think you don't need a new ECU. IF the Gauge or ECU was doing some interpretation AND the EPS unit expected some kind of initialization signal you would get no power steering, it would act as normal - providing no assist. Because hooking up canbus causes the EPS to work at all means that the EPS is EITHER getting what it needs from canbus or it only needs power to activate. The fact that it seems to work from reports means that the role of canbus at this point is to provide either the raw speed data or some stepped signal that says 'turn down to level 2 assist' or something like that. If it is just the raw data, we are golden. If it requires CPU/ECU interpretation then we have a new problem to solve or need a newer ECU. Anyone who has already installed the system can simply disconnect the diag port to validate whether canbus has any effect on activation. Richard, when you get this up and running you should be able to check for speed moderation on a stand with some tension on the ski tips (bunjie or some helpful assistant holding the skit tips) as the amount of force (assist) is probably not super high.

The problem with it not moderating at speed or de-activating at speed is you will loose some trail feel while carving. High speed cornering will feel numb just like it did with automotive power steering before speed sensitive response was incorporated into cars.

 

[Tcat100]

Going to my house in the UP next weekend, but not sure if there will be enough snow to test

Well boys...it works! Tested today on 2" of snow on roads. Seems to work fine.
All in all, a pretty big win. Now the challenge will be to find parts...a lot are on backorder again!

 

[YamaSpark]

I'm almost done the install right now on my 2019, and I have to say its a real PITA! The voltage regulator needs to be moved to the front bulkhead as opposed to the right side (2 new holes drilled). And 3 holes drilled for the brackets that hold the EPS. I made a template for the holes when I had my old 2022 EPS sled in the shop that is now sold.

Richard - Any chance of you being able to supply a copy of the template for the rest of us fools, please?

Does anyone have pics of how the EPS motor brackets mount to the bulkhead?

Thanks!

 

[YamaSpark]

So, the rumor on the street is that the 'Winders/Cats with factory EPS come equipped with a high output stator.
I found this info on the web, so it has to be true, right?
For those of you who understand electronics better than I (I know enough to be dangerous), do you think that EPS could potentially draw enough power to burn out a standard stator?

 

[Tcat100]

So, the rumor on the street is that the 'Winders/Cats with factory EPS come equipped with a high output stator.
I found this info on the web, so it has to be true, right?
For those of you who understand electronics better than I (I know enough to be dangerous), do you think that EPS could potentially draw enough power to burn out a standard stator?

stator part numbers are identical, though that doesn't mean they didn't make a running change. I did run the GSE kit on my 19 for 2500 miles with no issues, and that has full power steering all the time, so I think it will be fine

 

[earthling]

So, the rumor on the street is that the 'Winders/Cats with factory EPS come equipped with a high output stator.
I found this info on the web, so it has to be true, right?
For those of you who understand electronics better than I (I know enough to be dangerous), do you think that EPS could potentially draw enough power to burn out a standard stator?

There is a battery connected in parallel. Its not like the EPS is drawing constantly or even at a constant rate.

 

[earthling]

stator part numbers are identical, though that doesn't mean they didn't make a running change. I did run the GSE kit on my 19 for 2500 miles with no issues, and that has full power steering all the time, so I think it will be fine

If the stator mattered, they would not use the same part number.

Curiously, there is a difference in regulator used. The regulator is what controls current flow through the stator. Despite the different part numbers the 2023 eps models use the same regulator as the older sleds, the 24 model uses a different part number which is shared with the viper and the 17 model year sidewinders.. I don't think it means anything at the end of the day because the 23 sled with EPS is the same sled and it uses the regulator that is used in all of the model years from 2018-2023.

The newer sleds use: 8JP-H1960-00-00
The 2018-2023 models use 8JP-H1960-10-00

 

[Richard Hodgins]

Richard - Any chance of you being able to supply a copy of the template for the rest of us fools, please?

Does anyone have pics of how the EPS motor brackets mount to the bulkhead?

Thanks!

I think I will probably start another thread shortly with a pretty basic “how to”. I took some pics, although not as many as I would have liked to make it crystal clear (I’m not meticulous like Rockerdan ), but I think I can come up with something fairly straight forward.
I wouldn’t say my template was great but will take measurements anyhow. I realized after a lot of these measurements could be double checked with another 23 and also the holes on the brackets themselves.

In the meantime here is a rudimentary mock-up of the 2 brackets that hold the power steering unit and how they are positioned. Not sure this will make sense to you!

 

[YamaSpark]

I think I will probably start another thread shortly with a pretty basic “how to”. I took some pics, although not as many as I would have liked to make it crystal clear (I’m not meticulous like Rockerdan ), but I think I can come up with something fairly straight forward.
I wouldn’t say my template was great but will take measurements anyhow. I realized after a lot of these measurements could be double checked with another 23 and also the holes on the brackets themselves.

In the meantime here is a rudimentary mock-up of the 2 brackets that hold the power steering unit and how they are positioned. Not sure this will make sense to you!

Thanks Richard,
Any information you can provide would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Tcat100]

Here are some tips
- Sorry I cant help with the positioning of the holes. I do know that if you can find one at a dealer, you can take your own measurements off of the outside. You need to drill 3 holes out of the total of 4 for the plate (1605-211) and bridging bracket (1605-212) to attach to the tub (the one on the left side already is there) with screws
- You need to relocate the voltage regulator to the front of the tub, from it's right side mounting. Will have to drill 2 holes to do that, and move the wiring
- At this time I would also remove the sled's ECU temporarily and pull the wire harness out of the tub to make more room to maneuver (I used a bungee cord to hold the harness out of the way), and replace when done
- I found that the easiest way to install stuff is to first mount the plate to the EPS on the bench by firmly securing the 2 bolts that don't go through the bridging bracket (so sitting on the sled, the 2 to the right), and second, positioning the bridging bracket in the tub (don't tighten down the 2 screws to the tub, but maybe just thread them until everything is done). Next snake the EPS into the tub, now turn it on it side so you can access the bottom, secure the coupling (1705-616) to the spline being super careful to line up the painted spline on the EPS to the slot on the coupling, and securing with the bolt and nut. Then, position the EPS with the coupling attached in the large hole that the old steering post went through, and tighten that large nut (from the bottom window where the tie rods go through. Secure the tie rod end at this time as well.
- Next install the remaining plate/bracket bolts into the EPS. The front one can be accessed from the top, while the rear one can be accessed through the tie rod window with a 3/8 u-joint and socket
- Next, secure the remaining plate screws in the tub, and tighten all 4 of them
- Last, secure the new steering shaft and don't forget the new lower post stop and mounting block

 

[YamaSpark]

Here are some tips
- Sorry I cant help with the positioning of the holes. I do know that if you can find one at a dealer, you can take your own measurements off of the outside. You need to drill 3 holes out of the total of 4 for the plate (1605-211) and bridging bracket (1605-212) to attach to the tub (the one on the left side already is there) with screws
- You need to relocate the voltage regulator to the front of the tub, from it's right side mounting. Will have to drill 2 holes to do that, and move the wiring
- At this time I would also remove the sled's ECU temporarily and pull the wire harness out of the tub to make more room to maneuver (I used a bungee cord to hold the harness out of the way), and replace when done
- I found that the easiest way to install stuff is to first mount the plate to the EPS on the bench by firmly securing the 2 bolts that don't go through the bridging bracket (so sitting on the sled, the 2 to the right), and second, positioning the bridging bracket in the tub (don't tighten down the 2 screws to the tub, but maybe just thread them until everything is done). Next snake the EPS into the tub, now turn it on it side so you can access the bottom, secure the coupling (1705-616) to the spline being super careful to line up the painted spline on the EPS to the slot on the coupling, and securing with the bolt and nut. Then, position the EPS with the coupling attached in the large hole that the old steering post went through, and tighten that large nut (from the bottom window where the tie rods go through. Secure the tie rod end at this time as well.
- Next install the remaining plate/bracket bolts into the EPS. The front one can be accessed from the top, while the rear one can be accessed through the tie rod window with a 3/8 u-joint and socket
- Next, secure the remaining plate screws in the tub, and tighten all 4 of them
- Last, secure the new steering shaft and don't forget the new lower post stop and mounting block

Thanks Tcat for the detailed information on the installation!
Now, if you could please give us some tips on the wiring, that would be great! I read through this thread a few times, but, unless I somehow missed it, I'm still uncertain about the wiring to the diagnostic port. Also, where is the best place to pull power for the unit?
Thanks much!

 

[Tcat100]

Thanks Tcat for the detailed information on the installation!
Now, if you could please give us some tips on the wiring, that would be great! I read through this thread a few times, but, unless I somehow missed it, I'm still uncertain about the wiring to the diagnostic port. Also, where is the best place to pull power for the unit?
Thanks much!

I actually did install a full harness (to my regret due the $600 cost). If you go to the country cat site you can get the wiring diagrams and figure it out. Elsewhere I listed the connectors you need to procure. For the main power I would just run a dedicated line to the battery with an inline 30 amp fuse, and a good ground, and call it a day. For the smaller connector, 2 wires will go to the diagnostic connector by the reverse actuator, and you can find switched power there too I believe for the 3rd wire.