Pilot 6.9 ski's installed

[ROCKERDAN]

Just a quick update.....

Been running my 6.9s since day 1. Now have approx 2100 miles on setup. I got the shims perfect as seen in my carbides. I ran the 8" Woodys executives(1/2'' round bar) for this entire time time since new. With the stock 4" squares to outers.

These carbides still have a ton of life left, however they are rounded and I like to steer on the roads ect.

Installed the new ACE(taller rectangular) Woodys bars today, and will run this weekend for first time. These really look nice, and are 1/8" taller when compared directly to the Woodys round bars. So these will be more aggressive which the pilots need, and should be the perfect setup Im looking for.

Couple pics below, showing the wear on round bars after 2k miles and good shimming.

Dan


Nice even wear means good shimming, which is a must with any pilot ski IMO.

5/8'' total height ACE

1/2'' total height round bars(these are worn so they are below)

 

[BADSLED]

I really like the ACE design offered by Woody's. Please keep us posted on pros/cons of this carbide.

 

[number1kyster]

Dan,

How much shim are you running? It is added to the rear of the ski rubber, correct?

I currently have an 18 RTX with 5.7's an no shim. It darts like crazy. Toe out is 1/8".

 

[ROCKERDAN]

Dan,

How much shim are you running? It is added to the rear of the ski rubber, correct?

I currently have an 18 RTX with 5.7's an no shim. It darts like crazy. Toe out is 1/8".

SHIMS
I have ended up with 1/4" thick shims on mine. But please read.

On page one, post #3 I have the info for shims(red),
https://ty4stroke.com/threads/pilot-6-9-skis-installed.146599/#post-1343311

Also post #598 I talked about this, and MANY other times.
https://ty4stroke.com/threads/pilot-6-9-skis-installed.146599/page-40#post-1407973

Dan

SHIMS

I think anyone starting off new with the pilots and stock SW rubbers, should start with the original setup.

my 3/8 shims were way too much, and I am going to modify them heavily today and follow the new progress.

Only thing I can assume is, these SOFT stock SW rubbers must really sack in alot over a time period, but for me so far...I really do NOT need any shim.

So I would start without shim and then watch your wear over time....and if yours wears fine, then leave it....but if it starts to sack the rubber and wearing out front, then start with a 1/4" shim but watch the wear and how they sit when installed.

I will keep updating this with my own actual progress over time with shim and carbide wear.

Dan




**IMPORTANT**
We have seen one member with shaper bars show heavy wear at the FRONT of his carbides. His sled is a 17. We think the stock soft rubbers may "set in" or "sack" over time. In his case, he added some thicker shims and his setup seems to be better, but he needs more time to watch the wear.

I did my own test(only 550 miles) and with shims added, mine wore too much in BACK of carbides. So in my case the shim was too much, and not needed at all.

We are not sure exactly the differences from his sled to mine, with exception of his is older and may have the rubbers sacked into the pilot pocket more.

My suggestion for new pilot installs, is to follow the instructions in this thread page 1. Trimming the rubbers ect as shown here. Run the setup for a couple hundred miles and be sure to check your carbide wear as much as possible in the first couple hundred miles. If your carbides show even wear, with the skis running nicely parallel to the ground then leave it alone. If you show wear at the front of carbide then add some 1/4 shims(Bergstrom). This may be something that needs to be updated as time/miles goes along. What works on season 1, may need slight shimming by season 2 as the rubbers sack/conform into the pilot pocket.

Please post your results in this thread and over time we will have a good handle on the shimming.

Dan

 

[number1kyster]

Thanks Dan. I've got 450 miles on my setup in perfect conditions. It's a bit early to tell how they are wearing.

 

[ROCKERDAN]

Quick update...

I ran the new ACE carbides this past weekend, and WOW....these things carve! Sure they are brand new, but they carve better then the brand new round bars did for certain. Slightly heavier effort but I can deal with that as they are so darn precise. I can now let off some shock pressure on fronts if I want, but I love how they are so precise now, and with the fresh snow we have been getting Ill take the bite.

I may consider Travis's power steering linkage kit, as it would work amazing im sure with this setup.

Dan

 

[number1kyster]

Quick update...

I ran the new ACE carbides this past weekend, and WOW....these things carve! Sure they are brand new, but they carve better then the brand new round bars did for certain. Slightly heavier effort but I can deal with that as they are so darn precise. I can now let off some shock pressure on fronts if I want, but I love how they are so precise now, and with the fresh snow we have been getting Ill take the bite.

I may consider Travis's power steering linkage kit, as it would work amazing im sure with this setup.

Dan

Dan,

The MPS kit is amazing. I have an RTX with 5.7s. My dad has an LTX with 5.7s and the MPS. We switch sleds often. His sled feels like half the steering effort.

You do loose a little turning radius though. IMO its worth it.

 

[RAMSOMAIR]

X2 for the MPS, it just works. Have on the SW (5.7 pilots) and the daughter's Viper (6.9 pilots). I also rode a fellow's 141 with air shocks yesterday and OMG what a bear to steer, he had 6.9 pilots.
I've been running a 3/16" aluminum shim for the first 3000 miles. Checked carbide wear as Dan did and found the front wearing more that the rear. Cut some 1/4" aluminum shims and much better now. As Dan indicated, have to check periodically as the rubber softens and wear in.

 

[race24x]

Hey Dan have you tried Shaper Bars? Did you like the Ace bars better than them as well? I have the 6.9s but in snow, it still pushes. I have one set of SHaper bars and then round bars on the outsides. I was considering Sno Trackers as my buddy has them on his Winder and wifes Viper and they seem pretty good.

 

[ROCKERDAN]

Dan,

The MPS kit is amazing. I have an RTX with 5.7s. My dad has an LTX with 5.7s and the MPS. We switch sleds often. His sled feels like half the steering effort.

You do loose a little turning radius though. IMO its worth it.

The one reason I have sorta skirted away from the MPS is losing the radius turning. I have many areas where I need the tight radius turning, so this is why I have sorta held back.

Dan

 

[ROCKERDAN]

Hey Dan have you tried Shaper Bars? Did you like the Ace bars better than them as well? I have the 6.9s but in snow, it still pushes. I have one set of SHaper bars and then round bars on the outsides. I was considering Sno Trackers as my buddy has them on his Winder and wifes Viper and they seem pretty good.

I did try the shapers on my previous procross/pilot setup and did not like them. I felt they darted more and were too heavy. And the cost that stud boy likes to charge for their items IMO is overpriced for the quality you get, Woody's pricing is very reasonable with very high quality.

All ski's will push in snow, that is inevitable. It comes down to how much push. For the most part, a groomed well setup trail is when we push the bigger speeds, and that is where these ACE bars out-perform the round bars, much more aggressive for sure.

I have never liked snowtrackers for many reasons, but push is one. Snowtrackers give a disconnected feeling IMO and push too much. Loss of MPG in soft snow and speed in soft/mild snow. One thing trackers do well is on rutted frozen mornings they will NOT DART. And that is the only benefit they offer IMO.

A 5.7 pilot will be a tad less pushy then the 6.9, since the 6.9 will float more up on soft. But in hardpack they should both be similar, and the taller ACE rectangular bar is more aggressive then the round, both being woodys.

For a truly aggressive setup with little to no push, you need to get into a C&A with larger/longer/flatter keels....but you can throw easy effort out the window and will certainly want MPS.

Skis/Carbides are always a compromise....having more of one aspect usually loses another aspect. I believe the Pilots to be the best overall compromise for this chassie. How a sled handles is always a subjective thing, and everyone rides differently, and different trails in diff conditions.

Dan

 

[number1kyster]

The one reason I have sorta skirted away from the MPS is losing the radius turning. I have many areas where I need the tight radius turning, so this is why I have sorta held back.

Dan

Our trails in Vermont are like this, and it hasn't been an issue yet.

 

[Scott Stedronsky]

The one reason I have sorta skirted away from the MPS is losing the radius turning. I have many areas where I need the tight radius turning, so this is why I have sorta held back.

Dan

Our trails in Vermont are like this, and it hasn't been an issue yet.

800 miles now on the new pilot 6.9's and I am going to order the mps rig from the Barn.
Did 3 days, 650 miles and my shoulders were hurtin. Not sure if the 137" makes any dif but on the 141 it was a bit rough.

 

[chaleurphantom]

I did try the shapers on my previous procross/pilot setup and did not like them. I felt they darted more and were too heavy. And the cost that stud boy likes to charge for their items IMO is overpriced for the quality you get, Woody's pricing is very reasonable with very high quality.

All ski's will push in snow, that is inevitable. It comes down to how much push. For the most part, a groomed well setup trail is when we push the bigger speeds, and that is where these ACE bars out-perform the round bars, much more aggressive for sure.

I have never liked snowtrackers for many reasons, but push is one. Snowtrackers give a disconnected feeling IMO and push too much. Loss of MPG in soft snow and speed in soft/mild snow. One thing trackers do well is on rutted frozen mornings they will NOT DART. And that is the only benefit they offer IMO.

A 5.7 pilot will be a tad less pushy then the 6.9, since the 6.9 will float more up on soft. But in hardpack they should both be similar, and the taller ACE rectangular bar is more aggressive then the round, both being woodys.

For a truly aggressive setup with little to no push, you need to get into a C&A with larger/longer/flatter keels....but you can throw easy effort out the window and will certainly want MPS.

Skis/Carbides are always a compromise....having more of one aspect usually loses another aspect. I believe the Pilots to be the best overall compromise for this chassie. How a sled handles is always a subjective thing, and everyone rides differently, and different trails in diff conditions.

Dan

True.

I run C&A MTX on my LTX LE with Studboy Dually's. There is virtually no push and no darting. There can however be heavy steering. With a bit of fine tuning with the QS3's, limiter strap all the way out, trimming of the coupling blocks etc... It has become more than acceptable. Still heavier than stock but not bad and it turns confidently.

 

[chaleurphantom]

800 miles now on the new pilot 6.9's and I am going to order the mps rig from the Barn.
Did 3 days, 650 miles and my shoulders were hurtin. Not sure if the 137" makes any dif but on the 141 it was a bit rough.

Do you have an air shock on front of skid?