2020 Release

[T-Bone]

Having worked with the Ford GT program and the all carbon fiber chassis the last couple years, it is very lightweight, however it is very expensive.
There have been a lot of complaints on sled prices, will people be willing to pay for the carbon fiber?

No, I don't think so. Cost of sleds, needs to come down, not go up. This is the dilemma the manufactures are faced with. Keeping consumer interested with the latest and greatest tech and chassis while keeping costs in check. For many consumers, I think they have reached their limit on what they are willing to pay.

 

[whitedust1]

Totally agree with this statement. We can all wear blue goggles if we want, but at least do it with an open mind.
And with regards to the comments about carbon fiber .... Yes, it will reduce weight which is a good thing. However, it will drive up the price of an already expensive sled. And, even though it would bring the weight down closer to the weight of a 2-stroke, it won't be long before the 2-strokes start using carbon fiber too. And then they will be much lighter than the 4-stroke again. It's a never ending battle....

No weight reduction really hasn’t been a never ending battle with Yamaha ever. If anything Yamaha kept adding weight with EPS , exup, the new reservoir front shock system,144 track , ck 2 shock suspension so on. Imo if Yamaha really made weight reduction important in a next generation platform we would see a much lighter sled. Just have to see what they do and keep an open mind. Skidoo’s are generally light but not front and center anymore that’s a Polaris thing. To me if a sled is well balanced lightest weight is not important. Only time I curse my Apex xtx is when I have to horse around my trailer or lift from a stuck.

 

[Smokum]

Same as the 2 above comments. Very happy on my Cat, I would go back but only if they gave me a reason to do so.

Quite the opposite experience on my end. I switched to a 2014 xf9000 and it was literally the biggest POS I have ever owned. Never made one ride without major issues. I had a 72 cheetah as a kid that was way more reliable....so it went down the road and I'm back on an Apex. For me, the SW and Viper still has way too much kitty DNA in it and the bad taste is still in my mouth.

That said, I dont disagree with switching if Yamaha doesnt have what you are after, it just didn't work for me.

 

[Deeppow16]

Quite the opposite experience on my end. I switched to a 2014 xf9000 and it was literally the biggest POS I have ever owned. Never made one ride without major issues. I had a 72 cheetah as a kid that was way more reliable....so it went down the road and I'm back on an Apex. For me, the SW and Viper still has way too much kitty DNA in it and the bad taste is still in my mouth.

That said, I dont disagree with switching if Yamaha doesnt have what you are after, it just didn't work for me.

What types of problems did you have?

 

[Smokum]

What types of problems did you have?

Major overheating in good snow conditions, steering shaft stripped out, primary clutch completely locked up at 1200 miles and needed a complete rebuild, belt issues (probably due to primary being a POS), reverse didn't work even after updates. Also have a couple other 1100N/A's in my group who have an electrical draw that kills their battery. Each of them has averaged a 1 new battery per year, even with trickle charger over summer. Now they disconnect battery over summer and use trickle. Same reverse issues on those sleds as well.

All the Cat's just seem cheap overall to me. Don't like their Torx, didn't like the panel fit & finish (which has been addresses on the SW from what I have seen). Maybe I'd have better luck with the SW since it has some Yamaha influence, but I lost my a$$ and a ton of riding time (which is the worst part of it all) on the XF9000 and I'm still sour about it, so I'll just stick with my trusty Apex for now and root for Yamaha to produce their own chassis again, or at least something they co-designed if it is still with Cat.

I am a believer in buying/riding what works for you, regardless of brand. Happens to be Yamaha for me right now, but who knows in the future.

 

[Deeppow16]

Major overheating in good snow conditions, steering shaft stripped out, primary clutch completely locked up at 1200 miles and needed a complete rebuild, belt issues (probably due to primary being a POS), reverse didn't work even after updates. Also have a couple other 1100N/A's in my group who have an electrical draw that kills their battery. Each of them has averaged a 1 new battery per year, even with trickle charger over summer. Now they disconnect battery over summer and use trickle. Same reverse issues on those sleds as well.

All the Cat's just seem cheap overall to me. Don't like their Torx, didn't like the panel fit & finish (which has been addresses on the SW from what I have seen). Maybe I'd have better luck with the SW since it has some Yamaha influence, but I lost my a$$ and a ton of riding time (which is the worst part of it all) on the XF9000 and I'm still sour about it, so I'll just stick with my trusty Apex for now and root for Yamaha to produce their own chassis again, or at least something they co-designed if it is still with Cat.

I am a believer in buying/riding what works for you, regardless of brand. Happens to be Yamaha for me right now, but who knows in the future.

I hear ya on that. My Nytro started to give me a lot of problems last year and I was getting pissed off about it. Then when I finally had it working good I found a hidden stump and totaled it. I really think it was a sign to move on and try another brand because I couldn't afford a brand new Yamaha and Arctic Cat had some crazy prices on lefts overs that I couldn't pass up. I have a lot of respect for Yamaha I just would really like to see something other then a motor from them.

 

[sideswipe77]

not to go off topic but we have a lot of rain coming this weekend so that means more replies on this thread.
with warmer temps.

 

[Deeppow16]

not to go off topic but we have a lot of rain coming this weekend so that means more replies on this thread.
with warmer temps.

Big storm predicted to roll through Iowa in the next couple days. Sure would be nice to get one of those to roll through central MN once in while. Haven't had a storm drop more the 6 inches of snow in a looooooong time at my house.

 

[03RX1-ER-LE]

2020 Textron 2s spy photo

https://detroit.craigslist.org/okl/snw/d/polaris-gemini-250-vintage/6750855575.html

 

[stevewithOCD]

Carbon Fiber has come a long way & become much cheaper to produce in the last 10 years.
That said, just dropping this motor down 2'' would be huge.
They need to re-design this chassis around the motor. DOO's 4-stroke G4 is wider then the 2-stroke G4.
Drop it down, move it over to the left a tad for better balance & lose 10 easy pounds to start with.

 

[Deeppow16]

Carbon Fiber has come a long way & become much cheaper to produce in the last 10 years.
That said, just dropping this motor down 2'' would be huge.
They need to re-design this chassis around the motor. DOO's 4-stroke G4 is wider then the 2-stroke G4.
Drop it down, move it over to the left a tad for better balance & lose 10 easy pounds to start with.

I was thinking last night what they could use the carbon fiber for without making the sled much more expensive. How about carbon fiber rails? I know as a mountain sled guy I would pay a little extra to have super light rails that wont bend if you land slightly off center. I think they could easily use them on trail sleds also. I'm actually kinda surprised that an OEM has tried this yet. I know their are after market carbon fiber rail out there but I feel any of the manufactures could easily do this.

 

[cannondale27]

Only 29 pages to go before the 2020 release!
Wieght. I know many had bad taste of Singleshot rear in Apex but it can work and it is very light and simple just needs a bit more shock work since many hate any airshock.

 

[CookeCityRider]

Found this picture from West Yellowstone Snow Expo March 1996. That was when Yamaha released the completely redesigned trailing arm chassis. I find it interesting that they were one of the lightest mountain sleds at the time. Any chance in 2020 we could see a competitive mountain sled again?

 

[blueironranger]

Found this picture from West Yellowstone Snow Expo March 1996. That was when Yamaha released the completely redesigned trailing arm chassis. I find it interesting that they were one of the lightest mountain sleds at the time. Any chance in 2020 we could see a competitive mountain sled again? View attachment 143378

Yep, the “radically new” single piece cast bulkhead really cut the weight in 97’ over competitive trailing arm sleds. I wonder how much a single piece aluminum bulkhead could cut wieght on the Procross chassis, quite a few separate pieces riveted together.

 

[Deeppow16]

Yep, the “radically new” single piece cast bulkhead really cut the weight in 97’ over competitive trailing arm sleds. I wonder how much a single piece aluminum bulkhead could cut wieght on the Procross chassis, quite a few separate pieces riveted together.

It would save weight for sure but would it be stronger then what they have already? Probably not. Ski-doo has a cast bulkhead and I know if you hit something hard enough it cracks it. The Procross/proclimb chassis is strong. It might be a little bit heavier but I would rather take that then a cracked bulkhead.