2020 Release

[Sasquatch]

I would define the chassis primarily as the tunnel through to the front frame. Drivetrain is clutches, jackshaft, chaincase and drive axle. Don't think I need to define suspension as you guys are obviously very knowledgeable.
Sasquatch, I am in complete agreement about the chaincase on the Winders. They are just fair. The Apex chaincase is better, but the hands-down winner of best chaincase EVER goes to the Nytro and Phazer. What a beautifully engineered design that is. So easy to change a track on those.
I'm don't think the oil tank design on the Cat is bad, I just don't like that they didn't use a proper gasket. The Apex and Nytro oil tanks could have been much better also. They eventually crack and leak or the mounting tabs crack too.
I really think that if Cat and Yamaha built a machine from the ground up TOGETHER combining their best ideas it would be just awesome.

Ya I know lots of complaints about the oil tank on the Yamaha's. I had no problem with my Warrior in 18,000 miles or my Apex. I did put the rubber washers on them to absorb a bit of shock. I agree totally if the two could work together and build a common machine it could be great. I had hoped when the partnership was first announced that Yamaha would get Cats suspension and Cat the Yamaha motors. This kinda excited me as Yamaha lacked in the suspension dept. What has happened though since that day has shocked me. I keep waiting for a great Yamaha but all I see is Cats, pure Cats! Might as well buy a T-Cat same sled. I won't even get into the loss of the Four hole 998 its kinda one more reason I don't want a Cat. NA three hole is way down on power and I just like NA although the Jack shaft supercharged 998 might raise an eyebrow with me.

 

[Sasquatch]

Okay so since everyone is trying to get this discussion to 100 pages, just thought I would jump into the fray and add my 2 cents worth. First have to say that I favor the Yamaha DB style machine over the Procross Yamaha units (kinda with Sasquatch on this). But my preference has nothing to do with which one is better quality, or ride, or plushness, or any of those other apparent flaws that have been discussed here for both styles.

For me it is all about rider positioning on the sled. Now I will freely admit that I have never ridden a unit with the Procross chassis, but I have ridden other rider forward machines (Polaris, Ski-Doo) and just not a fan of the sitting position. I am an old school rider, learned to ride on the more traditional 'sit down' style of the old IFS chassis machines and I still prefer that riding position. But since I am also a big 4 stroke guy, and since there seems to be little argument that Yamaha 4 strokes are high quality power plants, traditional Yamaha with it's sit down rider positioning was my choice, and I have not regretted it yet. Is my machine choice better then yours? Maybe, maybe not, but since we all have a choice, we can do what we want with our money and buy and ride what we like.

So as many have said on here, ride what you like and enjoy the ride on whatever frame style you like and enjoy that we all have a choice. If that does not work for you, argue on!

And this is my point as much as people like to run down the DB it just works fine for many people, and that motor!

 

[Sasquatch]

Never rode in deep powder in the mountains, would like to give it a try but love groomed trail riding.
Seems like a snow bike would be hard to use since wide long track seems to be needed to stay on top of the powder. At least that is what I see in the UP with the wanabe mountain riders with their super long 3" paddle track on the groomed trails.

I have never rode the steep and deep and my brother keeps trying to get me to go but I think he just wants to give me a heart attack. Groomed trail all the way with tons of lakes and crown land to ride powder I'm happy

 

[Sasquatch]

Exactly, one of reason I love my Winder is the seat height and feet further forward. And they still are not quite as comfy as a Doo or Pol. This means hips and knees feel better.

The problem is every time they raise the seat they shorten it and shove the rider forward, You have no more seat to move back on, add to that when the chassis kicks you forward on every bump it just becomes so painful on the knees. One more reason I like the 2011 DB. It doesn't kick you forward, it lets you sit where you want. Now if they kept the seat length and let you sit back if you want it would be great but they don't. Not everyone wants rider forward even the 2011 Apex they started crowding forward. Stop it!

 

[Snowaddict]

Ya I know lots of complaints about the oil tank on the Yamaha's. I had no problem with my Warrior in 18,000 miles or my Apex. I did put the rubber washers on them to absorb a bit of shock. I agree totally if the two could work together and build a common machine it could be great. I had hoped when the partnership was first announced that Yamaha would get Cats suspension and Cat the Yamaha motors. This kinda excited me as Yamaha lacked in the suspension dept. What has happened though since that day has shocked me. I keep waiting for a great Yamaha but all I see is Cats, pure Cats! Might as well buy a T-Cat same sled. I won't even get into the loss of the Four hole 998 its kinda one more reason I don't want a Cat. NA three hole is way down on power and I just like NA although the Jack shaft supercharged 998 might raise an eyebrow with me.

Come on dude. The Sidewinder is not a "pure cat." The motor is not and neither is the ECU or clutching. We all know you love your Apex. That's great, but don't keep speaking falsehoods about other models. I love my Apex and like my Vector too btw.

 

[03RX1-ER-LE]

The problem is every time they raise the seat they shorten it and shove the rider forward, You have no more seat to move back on, add to that when the chassis kicks you forward on every bump it just becomes so painful on the knees. One more reason I like the 2011 DB. It doesn't kick you forward, it lets you sit where you want. Now if they kept the seat length and let you sit back if you want it would be great but they don't. Not everyone wants rider forward even the 2011 Apex they started crowding forward. Stop it!

I rode my buddies 2016 Viper LTX DX and it was very different then my RX1. I am only 5'-7" and I kept bashing my knees on the tank and annoyed being pushed forward all the time. I liked you could stand quickly if needed, but sitting which is what I mostly do was not comfortable being pushed forward all the time. The other thing was the sled ran out of top end all the time, just not enough motor. When my RX was stolen I picked up my 09 Apex ER and I am real happy with the difference in ride and power of the Apex over my RX. I am really looking forward to trying out my XTX if we can get some rideable conditions without having to drive 10 hours to the western UP.

 

[Mileage Quest]

Wow what a pissing match!!!!

I’d like to see this thread get back on track!!!

I said it before and now I’ll say it again... I have no clue what’s in store for 2020... Yamaha’s new strategy with pre order only and limited dealer inventory, I believe is Yamaha playing the supply and demand game... with low snow totals and shorter riding seasons upon us they are creating a demand for their product...

I also believe Textron: will sell Arctic cat (snow line), all the patents, dealership naming rights, manufacturing in Thief River Falls and hopefully the engineering staff to Yamaha... Yamaha will then manufacture sleds here in the USA for North America... They will clean up the fit and finish in Theif River Falls... Will this fix all the issues with manufacturing and defects??? Probably not but those come with any complex manufacturing process...

What we should be complaining about is the fall off in Yamaha honoring warranty claims.... Not what chassis we feel is better for our riding style!!! That is a matter of preference for the individual rider!!!

 

[biffdotorg]

What I find humorous are the rumors on the Wildcat forum of their beloved new Wildcat XX going away. Let's be real, it's the most amazing dirt product they have come out with in 6 years. The reason this is pertinent to this conversation is the Yamaha engine is the heart of that beast. It's not going anywhere, but may in the current configuration.

My answer to that rumor would be that if the engine agreement with Yamaha went away, they would keep the XX chassis, or a close rendition of it and replace that motor with a Textron supplied Weber motor. Thus, it would not be an XX anymore, but a new version of it with a weber, and they would name it something else. That is totally possible. And keep in mind, Textron split off Textron Off road, and Arctic Cat snowmobiles. It's possible that AC could be sold off, and the agreement stays in place for AC and not Textron off road. That seems way more likely.

That rumor gets my mind spinning towards the end of the agreement more than Textron off road fans losing their XX. Either way, it's all rumors.

 

[TPAY243]

Weber does not build a competitive high performance 4 stroke engine but they make one heck of a lawnmower powerplant. A lot of R&D went into the XX so I don't think it's going away anytime soon. From what I've been hearing they will be releasing a turbo version in the near future and it is the 998 Yamaha motor but a different manufacturers turbo system.

 

[thor452]

If we get 2 more people to argue with Sasquatch we will hit 100 pages before schedule. LMAO

 

[DGZRT]

If we get 2 more people to argue with Sasquatch we will hit 100 pages before schedule. LMAO

Thor , I have a cabin in Suring Wi . I know they opened up the Bike trail north of Suring . Anything Else open that you know of ??

1. Oconto County

• Status: Partially Open
• Condition: Poor-Partially Open
• Base: 1-4 inches | Groomed
• Last Updated: 1/4/2019 9:45:10 AM

The Paul Bunyan Riders (Lakewood) as well as The Red Arrow Snowmobile Club (Townsend) will open the trails at 8:00 am today, December 29th. We have a good base but there is ice and large ruts as well as many rocks sticking out. You are advised to ride with extreme caution. There will be little or no lube for your slides. Ride safe and pray for snow. Get updated trail reports for Oconto County by texting: TOURISM to: 36000

 

[03RX1-ER-LE]

With the way winters are going the 2020 needs to have a bogie wheel skid and wheels instead of skis.
Just need to figure out how to cool it with no snow on the heat ex-changers.

 

[HighSpeedLowDrag]

Just need to figure out how to cool it with no snow on the heat ex-changers.

Someone full of piss and vinegar could help with that.

 

[Tarzan]

If Yamaha ore Yamaha/Cat come with a new chassi,i hope they can make it with the best chaincase ever built (Nytro chaincase) and that it will fit Viper engine,Sidewinder engine with turbo and Apex engine. And a engine with 80-100hp. And light wight. And tou can choose differen length from trail to mountain. Preorder it is fine with me if i can choose what engine i want and lenght,color,seat,suspension,shocks and can chose if i want a trail ore mountain track on it. AND that it will have the apex ore Nytro PRIMARY CLUTCH Just like you order a car

 

[SaskAttack]

I like the thought that with just "made to order" yamaha's we can order our sleds the way we want them. But reality tells me this would be difficult on the assembly line. Not like they charge enough now!

For you guys that end of pushed forward on the seat, I find this odd. I am 6'6 and don't even need knee pads.