Canadian Federal Court Outlaws Sales Of AC Procross Sleds in Canada

[greatwhite89]

Those warning stickers are one of the first things to go bye bye when I get a new sled.

Have you ever noticed the warning stickers on your brand new sled getting larger and larger over the years? I'm pretty sure that every warning sentence is a result of some idiot hurting themselves and a resulting lawsuit.

Whatever happened to common sense?

New SideWinder warning stickers. Both sides of the cowling:

View attachment 155657 View attachment 155658

The sticker from my old '74 GPX:

View attachment 155659

 

[jjmoneysauce]

I did check the weights for the 115...I stand corrected there is 7 pounds more weight for my model etc...that settles it then, when this engine blows I'm getting a Yamaha 4 stroke on the back. I always heard that 4. strokes are so much more weight than a 2 stroke in the outboard category, in the instance that rule doesn't apply. the scuppers on my 18' Sea Ox are very close to waterline and a problem with allot of weight on the stern...the e tec came with the boat. The users on this site are very sharp...thanks for the correction. How do you like your RS Venture DX? I just got a STX sidewinder GT and its a great machine...much superior to the Rs Tf I had.

4 stroke outboards are getting better all the time. For comparison, I looked at upgrading my 2008 200 3.3L, they now make a 225 4.2L that is 80 or more lbs lighter. That same motor can deliver up to 300hp. The evolution has in my opinion made 2 strokes irrelevant.

 

[Farmer 73]

4 stroke outboards are getting better all the time. For comparison, I looked at upgrading my 2008 200 3.3L, they now make a 225 4.2L that is 80 or more lbs lighter. That same motor can deliver up to 300hp. The evolution has in my opinion made 2 strokes irrelevant.

Its interesting how the weight of the 4 stroke outboard is as close to the weight of a 2 stroke. Why would anybody buy the 2 stroke outboard? It also makes you wonder if they can get the outboards that close in weight, why can't they in sled engines? I think that question would have to be answered by an engineer!

 

[jjmoneysauce]

I’m not that l

Its interesting how the weight of the 4 stroke outboard is as close to the weight of a 2 stroke. Why would anybody buy the 2 stroke outboard? It also makes you wonder if they can get the outboards that close in weight, why can't they in sled engines? I think that question would have to be answered by an engineer!

I’m not that kind of engineer. But an outboard is different than a sled motor. It’s lower RPM and big displacement (4.2L vs 1.0L). A sled makes its power in kind of a different way at a high speed, and it has to rev up and down both quickly and a lot. Outboards are usually set at one RPM and just deliver steady power and torque. On the face of it, that’s my guess. Different animal, different behavior.

 

[Farmer 73]

I’m not that l


I’m not that kind of engineer. But an outboard is different than a sled motor. It’s lower RPM and big displacement (4.2L vs 1.0L). A sled makes its power in kind of a different way at a high speed, and it has to rev up and down both quickly and a lot. Outboards are usually set at one RPM and just deliver steady power and torque. On the face of it, that’s my guess. Different animal, different behavior.

That makes sense. I guess with a sled the power delivery is very different than a boat. On a boat, when under a load the torque is always needed, there is really no cruise mode where you would need less, like a sled.

 

[whitedust1]

You have seasonal oil change for 4s Evinrude 2s you add 2s oil push button for fogging. BUT Ihave to admit boat OEMS don’t allow easy access to 2s oil tanks. The etecs are good outboards but Mercury and Yamaha were kicking butt in the marketplace.

 

[jjmoneysauce]

Outboards became a 2 horse race. Yamaha well in the lead and Mercury giving their best shot. Suzuki and Honda and a couple others still frittering around nibbling on the scraps. Look at photos from ocean marinas...pretty much all Yamaha. The new 425 is competing against diesels on some very big boats.

Evinrude was kind of an anomaly. Some guys loved them, but to me they always seemed to be a one trick pony making themselves irrelevant as a brand by not really moving forward with their technology. Meanwhile, Yamaha is just crushing it every year.

 

[Farmer 73]

Outboards became a 2 horse race. Yamaha well in the lead and Mercury giving their best shot. Suzuki and Honda and a couple others still frittering around nibbling on the scraps. Look at photos from ocean marinas...pretty much all Yamaha. The new 425 is competing against diesels on some very big boats.

Evinrude was kind of an anomaly. Some guys loved them, but to me they always seemed to be a one trick pony making themselves irrelevant as a brand by not really moving forward with their technology. Meanwhile, Yamaha is just crushing it every year.

I know the market for sleds is just not there these days for Yamaha to put much of its resources into R&D. Its makes you wonder though, how advanced they would be and what their product would look like if corporate went full bore into it, like they do with their outboards!

 

[nbsledder]

As I understand it, nothing to do with Yamaha.
Anyone familiar with Quebec knows they love protectionism.
Anyone ever watched the movie on Netflix about the maple syrup cartel?
Quite interesting.

Yes always getting there way especially BRP!

 

[nbsledder]

I’ve spent a lot of time in Belarus tractors. They were alright. We even had one that I’ll say I liked using. They are a little short on creature comforts compared to other makes of similar vintage

I have a belarus and a massey....other than the electrical there very reliable and tough...the engines are long lasting

 

[nbsledder]

Yes.. better yet.. for Cat to get around this court order just call the pro cross chassis the new immigrant chassis from Cat, then the RCMP in Canada will help carry the chassis across the field at the US border into Canada, Cat will most likely get a rebate on each chassis from Canada's Government.

This is true

 

[sailor joe]

Outboards became a 2 horse race. Yamaha well in the lead and Mercury giving their best shot. Suzuki and Honda and a couple others still frittering around nibbling on the scraps. Look at photos from ocean marinas...pretty much all Yamaha. The new 425 is competing against diesels on some very big boats.

Evinrude was kind of an anomaly. Some guys loved them, but to me they always seemed to be a one trick pony making themselves irrelevant as a brand by not really moving forward with their technology. Meanwhile, Yamaha is just crushing it every year.

agree...all Yamaha around here in Rhode Island..a few Honda's and Suzuki..very few etec's

 

[PAvector]

I thought Canada patents time out after 20 years. If the ruling is based on an 2002 patent infringement, can they sell the procross in two years or any new pyramid design in Canada in 2022?

 

[74Nitro]

Well this thread has really gone off-topic, but while we are on the new subject of outboard engines, I must admit I hadn't looked at the lineup in a while.
I had no idea they were building engines this big in outboards. 5.6 with 425 prop HP. That would be highly sought after in 1/2 ton pickups, although maybe it is no more HP per cubic inch than the current Ford 5.0
Anyone know how crankshaft HP would compare?

 

[blueironranger]

Well this thread has really gone off-topic, but while we are on the new subject of outboard engines, I must admit I hadn't looked at the lineup in a while.
I had no idea they were building engines this big in outboards. 5.6 with 425 prop HP. That would be highly sought after in 1/2 ton pickups, although maybe it is no more HP per cubic inch than the current Ford 5.0
Anyone know how crankshaft HP would compare?

They say about 7-10% loss through the lower unit from when outboards use to be crank rates (old Evinrude twins/triples lost 5hp when they switched to prop rated).
Probably an honest 450hp+ BUT outboards have an unlimited supply of cold water to cool them off, which helps greatly. Big diesels I have worked on are ~2300hp MAX in mining equipment but the same engine can be rated up to 3000hp in a marine environment for the same base engine.

BRP may have won the snowmobile race but Yamaha won the Marine race, which is far more profitable. BRP bought Evinrude for the DI patents on the CHEAP and attempted to resurrect the outboard but eventually failed. They had to keep upsizing the displacement and add weight to make the lean 2 strokes survive long WOT runs which allowed the 4 strokes to catch up. Once the weight advantage was gone, 4 stroke pushed them out. I liked the Etec outboards and there is no denying that they have more "punch" out of the hole but they are far from the "simple" that BRP claimed.