New Apex v. Ski Doo 800

[Mad Russian]

Or a good track ... So the apex is not just spinning from a 25 roll and the e tec is alreddy up by 4 sleds lol

 

[jtssrx]

Or a good track ... So the apex is not just spinning from a 25 roll and the e tec is alreddy up by 4 sleds lol

Or a new nytro

 

[07 Apex Gt]

went to radar runs last weekend north of orillia the 800 etecs were getting smoked by apex's all day long the track was 2500 ft i seen a 2009 800 ptek that ran 111mph compared to a 2012 etec that ran 105 and a stock 2011 apex se 116.9 mph ,two of my buddies riding doo's were very impressed with the apex on the lake but would'nt give up they're sleds for the trail

 

[Murse]

Walk by my father in laws 800 etec all day. 2012 800r vs 06 Apex Apex wins in drag race. All trail conditions doo takes the win.

 

[jtssrx]

I spelled out the mph difference with the gearing calculator. A drag race at its longest is 1325 "1/4 mile" at its shortest 500 feet "grass drag" . 2500 feet isn't a drag race it's a radar run.

 

[07 Apex Gt]

radar run is exactly what i said , still don't change speeds they were runnin

 

[jtssrx]

radar run is exactly what i said , still don't change speeds they were runnin

To read the first couple pages. The apex runs a high mph becuase it spins close to 1000 more RPMs at the clutch. It's math no more no less

Another word it's apples to oranges

 

[kviper]

radar run is exactly what i said , still don't change speeds they were runnin

To read the first couple pages. The apex runs a high mph becuase it spins close to 1000 more RPMs at the clutch. It's math no more no less

Another word it's apples to oranges

So your saying just because that's how it works out on paper for the extra MPH thats what it is?
Fact is an Apex will never pull the gearing they come with.
Those would be theoretical number's. Just because somthing runs more RPM does not automatically equal more MPH. Power is power no mater what RPM it is made at and it will only pull so much load. Look at drive ling efficiency and power curve for your answer first. Comparing an Apex power curve to an 800 E-Tec is kind of like comparing a diesel to a comparable HP gas motor. Apex=big block, Doo=small block.

 

[jtssrx]

radar run is exactly what i said , still don't change speeds they were runnin

To read the first couple pages. The apex runs a high mph becuase it spins close to 1000 more RPMs at the clutch. It's math no more no less

Another word it's apples to oranges

So your saying just because that's how it works out on paper for the extra MPH thats what it is?
Fact is an Apex will never pull the gearing they come with.
Those would be theoretical number's. Just because somthing runs more RPM does not automatically equal more MPH. Power is power no mater what RPM it is made at and it will only pull so much load. Look at drive ling efficiency and power curve for your answer first. Comparing an Apex power curve to an 800 E-Tec is kind of like comparing a diesel to a comparable HP gas motor. Apex=big block, Doo=small block.

The madrussian runs exactly what the gear chart says for the gearing he runs. If you have enough motor you can run more mph if your clutches are cut for over drive. Are some sleds over geared sure but what the hell does that have to do with what we are talking about? Both sleds have shown similar hp yet the apex runs better mph and why is that? Because its peak power is close to 1000 RPMs higher then a etec. If Yamaha could take 200 pounds off the apex the etec would really be screwed. It's light weight bottom end advantage would be bye bye.


I don't really know what your trying to argue????

 

[kviper]

For the gearing he run's! And cut clutches! Now your not talking Apex's in general. Before you were generalizing Apex's, RPM calculated out= 10 MPH. Big difference!
As I said, just because it makes peak at more RPM doesn't necessarily=X more MPH. If it pulls the gearing maybe but as I said most Apex's will not pull the gearing they have (on snow). The only differance you see in the two sled's is a thousand RPM that peak power is made. The huge power band the Apex has is the reason you can pull the he'll out of it out of the hole and not fall on it's face and the reason you can run it past peak power and still gain MPH top end. Put traction with the low end Torque and the Doo will have it's hand's full out of the hole as well. What the he'll I am trying to point out is there is more to it. Ha WTF do I know! Your right the Apex is faster because it runs more RPM.

 

[Mad Russian]

And no matter how much u mod the fx nytro with out a turbo or supercharger or nos the nytro has no chance against 800 e tec or the new apexs....

 

[jtssrx]

For the gearing he run's! And cut clutches! Now your not talking Apex's in general. Before you were generalizing Apex's, RPM calculated out= 10 MPH. Big difference!
As I said, just because it makes peak at more RPM doesn't necessarily=X more MPH. If it pulls the gearing maybe but as I said most Apex's will not pull the gearing they have (on snow). The only differance you see in the two sled's is a thousand RPM that peak power is made. The huge power band the Apex has is the reason you can pull the he'll out of it out of the hole and not fall on it's face and the reason you can run it past peak power and still gain MPH top end. Put traction with the low end Torque and the Doo will have it's hand's full out of the hole as well. What the he'll I am trying to point out is there is more to it. Ha WTF do I know! Your right the Apex is faster because it runs more RPM.

Who said he has cut clutches?? I was giving you an exsample of how a sled can exceed peak mph with x gearing

You tell me why does he apex run better mph then a sled that makes the same hp it its not becuase it spins higher rpm.

 

[evil eagle]

Here's my take on the 800 etecs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxPtwJURuqI

I guess I have to get a video camera for next year

The cameras are great. It clears up all the bs when people say this or that.

 

[evil eagle]

The one thing a lot of you are forgetting is these are not race sleds. These are trail sleds so the chest thumping I'm reading is very funny becuase not one of our sleds would be competitive against anything that is setup to race only.


When you look at the woodgate shoot out results the apex is dead last in year in and year out. Those are 1000 foot runs in a controlled environment. Not some guys video he posts racing who knows how far against who knows what. Numbers don't lie

yeah I know what is a trail sled and what isn't. In my vids of that day and I have about 10 witn the same result. All the sleds were trial driven into that lake includeing myself. I drove 103 miles one way to that lake.
The ones that are cloer to home are set up better. the etec have bondi air boxes and the power tec exhaust on them and great clutching. those ones are sometimes ahead of my sled in the short run and ony fall back a few lenths after 1000 feet. I wish i had the camera on for the few races i had with the modded ones.

 

[kviper]

For the gearing he run's! And cut clutches! Now your not talking Apex's in general. Before you were generalizing Apex's, RPM calculated out= 10 MPH. Big difference!
As I said, just because it makes peak at more RPM doesn't necessarily=X more MPH. If it pulls the gearing maybe but as I said most Apex's will not pull the gearing they have (on snow). The only differance you see in the two sled's is a thousand RPM that peak power is made. The huge power band the Apex has is the reason you can pull the he'll out of it out of the hole and not fall on it's face and the reason you can run it past peak power and still gain MPH top end. Put traction with the low end Torque and the Doo will have it's hand's full out of the hole as well. What the he'll I am trying to point out is there is more to it. Ha WTF do I know! Your right the Apex is faster because it runs more RPM.

Who said he has cut clutches?? I was giving you an exsample of how a sled
can exceed peak mph with x gearing










Man, are we taking stock Apex's or with mod's you talked about in your last post. If you want to prove your point as to why a stock Apex run's more top
end than a stock Doo (and by the way an Apex will start pulling away well before toped out) stay on the same page!
I sure don't know every thing but let me try to explain why your 1,000 RPM has no effect. A Dyno measures load (torque) and monitors RPM. At every given RPM a computer multiplys Torque X RPM devided by 5252 to get a HP
number. So the 150 HP number is based on the RPM it's made at. Still 150 HP!
Your drive shaft is the load just like on the Dyno and the power the motor makes dictates the speed it can spin that shaft, your clutches and gearing transfer the power. If you gear back to gain torque multiplication you will eventually get to where your number's on paper, Max RPM, Max shift, gearing, etc will come out to what you can pull but your drive shaft only
knows the power that is driving it not what RPM your motor or primary clutch
is spinning.
Why does an Apex pull away from a same HP Doo on the big end? Drive line efficiency, Power band, weight is less of a factor as acceleration taper's off. I am hearing the Doo starts to drop power on longer pull's?






That makes more sense than anything.



You tell me why does he apex run better mph then a sled that makes the same hp it its not becuase it spins higher rpm.