Thinking about tunes - one tune? flasher? jukebox?

[STAIN]

. Make a belt that’s meant to stand up to the power these sleds have...not make us use a belt that’s meant for the Apex, that’s 55hp less!!

That belt seems to stand up to turbo charged and super charged Apexs OK. I don't believe the belt is the problem. There has to be some kind of alignment/ clutching issues.

 

[HURRICANE]

There is a huge alignment problem on the sidewinder. The secondary offset is way off!!

 

[ROCKERDAN]

Dan, is the Hurricane 240 tune you have a quick spool tune as well.I ran TD ecotrail sm tune this season, noticable increase in power but hard on fuel, thinking a less resrictive exhaust will help,TD stock muffler mod or Hurricane stock muffler replica. Want to keep sled quiet as possible

I cant say for sure about the 240, but I will say I pull more weight in my clutch on hurricane 240 map then I did on TD PT map. And I ran the 240 map all weekend up in Qc. and it was a blast. I do prefer the 270/290 maps around locally here though, for most snap corner to corner. Those are animals. And as Mike says you can go thru a belt with your right thumb easily.

Dan

 

[ROCKERDAN]

You'll want the Flasher and bundle of tunes so you're not locked in. It's tough to keep a belt on these things if you ride aggressive on the big tunes. I may even go down to the 225 stock muffler tune next winter after running on 270 & 290. I want to give the PB80 a whirl at some point and doubt very much it will stay cool on anything over 240.

I'm hoping to figure out how to keep rollers in the stock drive clutch too for any length of time and belts on the sled with the big tunes next season also. Or maybe, just maybe the PB80 will be the setup to have after seeing the issues with the stock drive clutch, we'll see next season now if there's a fix for the roller and belt problems besides turning down the power if you ride aggressive.

Get a flasher if you want to play or you are locked in without updates and tune changes. They'll come a time when you want to do something different. I only flashed a couple sleds this season with single tunes, its much more rare for single tunes. Plus the flasher gives much more for options like the Jukebox, logging and code reading and clearing. IMO the flasher is a no brainer and should be a must have.

Mike recommended to me the flasher w/ entire hurricane map suite when I was deciding. I can say I am very happy I went with Mikes recommendations. Having all the maps is simply amazing, and at the show pricing it was a no brainer.

Mike, I was really hoping you would have tested the PB80 this winter. I would love to hear what you find out with one in testing. If anything, it sure should have longevity with literally no moving parts. It would be interesting to hear if it rattles or not too. Even if performance is down some, It could be a very good alternative at a great price point.

Likely wont help belt life, but wouldnt that be crazy if for some reason it did? I think we need to test this. Lets face it, there is not gonna be another sled/engine coming along with more power then this 998. So we really should dive into this and fix the crap cat DNA stuff and the very sub-par YAM clutching/belt life ect.

I think the offset is important as shown by Dave, but it sure seems many guys can still snap these belts at will. I just wish we could somehow retrofit out clutching dimensions to fit a CAT belt, at lease those belts are made for big HP.

Dan

 

[KnappAttack]

Mike recommended to me the flasher w/ entire hurricane map suite when I was deciding. I can say I am very happy I went with Mikes recommendations. Having all the maps is simply amazing, and at the show pricing it was a no brainer.

Mike, I was really hoping you would have tested the PB80 this winter. I would love to hear what you find out with one in testing. If anything, it sure should have longevity with literally no moving parts. It would be interesting to hear if it rattles or not too. Even if performance is down some, It could be a very good alternative at a great price point.

Likely wont help belt life, but wouldnt that be crazy if for some reason it did? I think we need to test this. Lets face it, there is not gonna be another sled/engine coming along with more power then this 998. So we really should dive into this and fix the crap cat DNA stuff and the very sub-par YAM clutching/belt life ect.

I think the offset is important as shown by Dave, but it sure seems many guys can still snap these belts at will. I just wish we could somehow retrofit out clutching dimensions to fit a CAT belt, at lease those belts are made for big HP.

Dan

Dan,
I will be flashing down to stock and stock muffler tune next season and trying the PB80 for sure, if it works at those lower power levels, I'll keep bumping it up. I have to get the proper bolt too because the bolt CVTech sent has the wrong threads on it.

I also have a brand new Cat Team primary to try as well. I'm getting tired of the Yamaha rollers & bushings going to crap and belt blowing when trying to have some fun in the fields. I have an idea that may work well with the team setup.

I truly believe Yamaha has sourced their clutches to China for the sidewinder, maybe I'm wrong, but they won't take any power for any length of time and remain durable.

So a lot to test including the fan in the side panel idea. Hope we can get a decent winter next season!

 

[ROCKERDAN]

Dan,
I will be flashing down to stock and stock muffler tune next season and trying the PB80 for sure, if it works at those lower power levels, I'll keep bumping it up. I have to get the proper bolt too because the bolt CVTech sent has the wrong threads on it.

I also have a brand new Cat Team primary to try as well. I'm getting tired of the Yamaha rollers & bushings going to crap and belt blowing when trying to have some fun in the fields. I have an idea that may work well with the team setup.

I truly believe Yamaha has sourced their clutches to China for the sidewinder, maybe I'm wrong, but they won't take any power for any length of time and remain durable.

So a lot to test including the fan in the side panel idea. Hope we can get a decent winter next season!

Good to hear Mike...I am hoping we can get these dialed to an acceptable degree of belt life.

I wondered and trying cat clutches. As I would go that route with their belt if it gave me belt life. I think for secondary its a no go as they Jshafts are different I believe. Would it be worth it to swap the Jshaft to cats too? If you only run the TEAM primary, how will that play with our winder secondary?

I wonder if the PB80 can take the big 290 tunes? I know the PB80 runs hotter as its closed, but man its simple with basically no parts to wear out for awhile. Would be a cool test.

Gonna be a long offseason.
Dan

 

[KnappAttack]

Good to hear Mike...I am hoping we can get these dialed to an acceptable degree of belt life.

I wondered and trying cat clutches. As I would go that route with their belt if it gave me belt life. I think for secondary its a no go as they Jshafts are different I believe. Would it be worth it to swap the Jshaft to cats too? If you only run the TEAM primary, how will that play with our winder secondary?

I wonder if the PB80 can take the big 290 tunes? I know the PB80 runs hotter as its closed, but man its simple with basically no parts to wear out for awhile. Would be a cool test.

Gonna be a long offseason.
Dan

My plan would be to run the Team primary, SideWinder driven and Cat length and width belt (probably an Carlisle XS827 belt) without anything to limit the driven deflection so the belt would be full tight at idle like the Cat is doing. I'd have no desire to swap to Cats POS team driven. I think the Winder driven is fine, the problem lies with Yamahas rollers with the weight needed for the big tunes. Cat primary would also allow a bit more OD so you could gear down too with it's 1.5" width belt, allowing for better belt life with lower gearing in the chaincase.

I doubt the PB80 will run cool enough on anything over 240, but don't know till I try it. Perhaps with the fan blowing cool air in, who knows. Lots to try for me next season for sure. I don't think the PB80 spring cup is going to be durable either. The guy that bought my 1200 turbo had one break this season and it had the right spring and spring guide in it too. It's why I've been reluctant to put it on this year, they still don't have a strong proven spring cup on them.

 

[DMCTurbo]

My plan would be to run the Team primary, SideWinder driven and Cat length and width belt (probably an Carlisle XS827 belt) without anything to limit the driven deflection so the belt would be full tight at idle like the Cat is doing. I'd have no desire to swap to Cats POS team driven. I think the Winder driven is fine, the problem lies with Yamahas rollers with the weight needed for the big tunes. Cat primary would also allow a bit more OD so you could gear down too with it's 1.5" width belt, allowing for better belt life with lower gearing in the chaincase.

I doubt the PB80 will run cool enough on anything over 240, but don't know till I try it. Perhaps with the fan blowing cool air in, who knows. Lots to try for me next season for sure. I don't think the PB80 spring cup is going to be durable either. The guy that bought my 1200 turbo had one break this season and it had the right spring and spring guide in it too. It's why I've been reluctant to put it on this year, they still don't have a strong proven spring cup on them.

Mike why not run a softer primary spring to keep the weight down? I've been running Ulmers pink 30/90 for 3000 miles, 2000 miles tuned. My primary rollers still look new. Just a thought.

 

[waldo1]

with a pipe, qay70 weights, cold air intake, stock fuel pump and stock map sensor - powertrail 270hp 15# 90 octane is the lowest tune needed for the worst gas your going to get no reason to go less than that - next is 91 octane 275hp max 17# tune but u need a map sensor for that -- my favorite 94 octane tune w stock pump is lean 17 at 290hp - my next favorite 94 octane 20 # at 300 hp but now u need a fuel pump upgrade - also need multi pac and gota have the data logging for 14 gage options and logging runs which is great - no need to look at gages. check your run out later at the bar.
if u want the cheapy way - just buy a - single tune at 91 o 275 hp - map sensor, pipe, cai, weights, thats all u need -

 

[74Nitro]

Anyone have thoughts on the Winders different primary sheave angle compared to the previous Yamaha clutches?
I my memory serves me correctly Yamaha had 13.5 degree sheaves 1994 and older then moved to 14.5 degree on 1995 and up. In order to achieve 'overdrive' on the Winder Yamaha again changed to sheave angle in order to bring the belt to the top. Possibly the different sheave angle stresses the belt more.
Having said all that I also would like to see a better belt developed. My 8JP did not last very long, and my buddy didn't get 100 mile on his new 17 when his 8JP shredded to bits.
The previous 8DN belt(that I use) made its debut in 1998 on a 135hp sled and was still used on the 18 Apex. Think about that.....20 years!

 

[KnappAttack]

Mike why not run a softer primary spring to keep the weight down? I've been running Ulmers pink 30/90 for 3000 miles, 2000 miles tuned. My primary rollers still look new. Just a thought.

I run a soft primary. For the most part I ran the stock spring and the Dalton Blue. Tried the Green for a brief period and didn't like the higher engagement of the green.

Even using the stock spring I was still at just over 81g of weight on the big tune.

Your rollers may look new outside, but have a look at the bushings, mine were cracking bushings as well as pushing them to one side, as fast as I could replace them when running hard. Possible the blown belts were cracking them as well when the clutch would slam open.

 

[journeyman]

Just curious, anyone ever run the STM clutches on anything? I saw a guy selling a '17 ZR9000 about a week ago for $9800 that had STM's on it. Just looking at them they definitely look like machine shop quality, the prices are such too.

 

[waldo1]

my ga friends with too much $ runs em - hes been avoiding me all year and riding with doos so he thinks hes fast ----

 

[journeyman]

I truly believe Yamaha has sourced their clutches to China for the sidewinder, maybe I'm wrong, but they won't take any power for any length of time and remain durable.

I have wondered the same thing about the quality.

A guy from Canada posted last week on FB about his clutch exploding, I never heard any more details though. Photos attached.......

Is the Team Primary on the TCat/ZR9000 beefed up from the ones that come on the rest of the Cats?

Was wondering if the previous Yamaha primary is strong enough to hold the power considering the current SW primary might be inferior in quality?

 

[waldo1]

no way - these clutches r tough,,, so far - that looks like the weight broke and stabbed the roller out - a broken apart weight did that id guess - lucky! mine went through belly. never found the roller... never weld on weights to add weight --- Kevin - AK - what kind of weights r those?