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What would you buy? NEED HELP

For what it is worth, I bought a used SW for my stepson with just under 10,000 miles (not kilometers) on it. It had been well maintained and serviced regularly by a good dealer. Of course my stepson blew up the primary by adding 40-50 more hp without adjusting the clutch, and he ripped a big hole out of the studded track. Now that we are past those two issues, the sled is awesome, and should be good for many more miles. Both issues were the result of owner modifications, and not the fault of the sled. I loved the sled so much, I had to go out and buy one for myself.
 

RobX-1 said:
Hmm, I wonder how I was able to put over 2500 miles on the first year of owning my 18 Apex XTX which now has over 5600 miles going into its third season. The group I ride with do exactly that; get up at 8AM, ride somewhere for lunch, and then come back to the cabin for supper and adult beverages only to repeat the following days. That's how we average close to 200 mile trips each day. To say the Apex is like riding an 80's sled is a bit of reach. Now, if you had substituted the RX-1 for the Apex then I could agree; although I still own mine. Different strokes for different folks doesn't make one less than the other. Now excuse me while I contact Doc and Marty and Get Back To The Future.
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80's no that is a stretch. That aside I also would ride 200 plus miles a day on my apex xtx and didn't think it could get much if any better than that so much so I added a super charger to the sled instead of upgrading it. Loved the sled even more. A couple years later the supercharger went out and sent crap through the motor thought it was done for. removed the SC did and oil change ran it 500 miles did another oil change and it has been running strong ever since. I got the boost bug from that and didn't trust after market so I decided to give a sidewinder a try. at first I hated it to some degree as the tuner skis made life very difficult added snow trackers to them no better maybe even worse went with cat skis and snowtrackers and now I am in love with this machine. The number one thing that makes it better is the ability to just suck up the bumps like they don't even exist. my buddies are still on apex xtx's and I am always waiting for them when it gets rough. They just cant take the bumps as hard/fast as I can. I go through a section and to me it was fairly decent not bad at all and they are like that section sucked. they both have star suspension upgrade and Cannondale refreshed their shocks so the machines are not out of service or in need of and updates or repairs they just don't handle the rough like a sidewinder. this same night and day difference was found upgrading from an 07 apex gt to the 2012 apex xtx only more drastic. At 200 miles in a day I am ready for more and the rest of the group is ready for dinner and a couch. this may be different for each person out there but for our group we all prefer the Sidewinder for the ride quality when it gets rough. when its smooth they both handle great but so did my 340 exciter what makes the sidewinder great there is the added power. Not to mention the apex needs upgrades to be as good as it can be and as comfortable as it can be. the sidewinder aside from the skis (thanks Yamaha) (stupid tuners) the sled can be rode comfortable as can be stock out of the box.
 
Guys it comes down to what you are comfortable with and your goals. Every summer I think oh I am getting to old to be going 80+mph through rough trail and hitting every jump I can find. Maybe it’s time to get a Apex and just slow down. Every winter I just can’t resist and do it all again amazed at capabilities of the sled. Tough call.
 
thor452 said:
80's no that is a stretch. That aside I also would ride 200 plus miles a day on my apex xtx and didn't think it could get much if any better than that so much so I added a super charger to the sled instead of upgrading it. Loved the sled even more. A couple years later the supercharger went out and sent crap through the motor thought it was done for. removed the SC did and oil change ran it 500 miles did another oil change and it has been running strong ever since. I got the boost bug from that and didn't trust after market so I decided to give a sidewinder a try. at first I hated it to some degree as the tuner skis made life very difficult added snow trackers to them no better maybe even worse went with cat skis and snowtrackers and now I am in love with this machine. The number one thing that makes it better is the ability to just suck up the bumps like they don't even exist. my buddies are still on apex xtx's and I am always waiting for them when it gets rough. They just cant take the bumps as hard/fast as I can. I go through a section and to me it was fairly decent not bad at all and they are like that section sucked. they both have star suspension upgrade and Cannondale refreshed their shocks so the machines are not out of service or in need of and updates or repairs they just don't handle the rough like a sidewinder. this same night and day difference was found upgrading from an 07 apex gt to the 2012 apex xtx only more drastic. At 200 miles in a day I am ready for more and the rest of the group is ready for dinner and a couch. this may be different for each person out there but for our group we all prefer the Sidewinder for the ride quality when it gets rough. when its smooth they both handle great but so did my 340 exciter what makes the sidewinder great there is the added power. Not to mention the apex needs upgrades to be as good as it can be and as comfortable as it can be. the sidewinder aside from the skis (thanks Yamaha) (stupid tuners) the sled can be rode comfortable as can be stock out of the box.
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I came from a Vector to a Viper, with the same experience that you have described. All my riding buddies except my wife (she won't give up power steering) have all switched to the Pro Cross from the Delta Box. As good as the Vector/Apex sleds were on groomed trails, they were really bad on the beat up trails at the end of the day. On my SW I upgraded my front shocks to QS3's, and I have the rear QS3 to add on before snow flies, but honestly, the LTX-DX rode really well with stock shocks; the QS3's are just frosting on the cake.

My longest ride last year was a little over 270 miles on a Saturday. Because it was a Saturday, everyone who owned a sled was on the trails, and and they were beaten up well before noon-time. I shudder to even think about what that last 100 miles would have been like on my Vector. I probably would still be in a full body cast.

I had a different experience with the Snow Trackers/Tuner skis combination; I have long been a fan of Snow Trackers and AC skis, and modified two Vipers and my stepson's SW with that combination before getting my own SW. When I bought my SW, I was leaving on a trip the next day, so I asked the dealer to put Snow Trackers on the Tuners. After 2,000+ miles, I am still very happy with them. Not quite as good as Trackers on the AC skis, but good enough for me not to change them in the off-season.
 
I will add that many are very comfortable working on Apex and all true Yamahas actually. It’s routine and the 8,10,12,14 and 17 mm routine along with quality fasteners and electronics does weigh with many a lot. It’s the fun factor that really puts me on the ProCross but I also have never ever not had fun on any sled made till stuck,broke or crashed!
 
Sled-ed said:
I am in a little pickle and need some advice. Both sleds are the same price.

2016 Apex LE brand new...zero km's
or
2018 Sidewinder L-TX 10,000 km's Perfect shape, no scratches

I love the blue colour of the Winder.

What would you buy and why ???

Thanks.
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Thats easy contrary to unpopular opinion I love the Apex. Brand new Apex would be my choice. I hear all the Apex is a poor riding handling sled but I then wonder how I was able to put over 30,000 miles on those poor handling riding sleds? I guess it boils down to what ya want, I wanted a reliable great trail rider and that is what I got. Zero issues or breakage, best steering ever, 350 mile days and lets never forget the best sounding sled ever. Now the seating position is not 80's or even 90's I rode the 80's and 90's sleds and still have one. The seating and leg stretch is perfect for me. Riding on a sled like a four wheeler would be good if they did not crowd you to the front, but even then its a more top heavy sled and needs more leaning into the corners. The Apex you can sit up straight and do not have to lean off the side to turn a corner. Course if you do you can corner faster. You just don't have to for a nice ride. An Apex is no good in the bumps only means you have never chased Steiner across a drifted lake or down a bumpy trail. Now I'm a big guy and I find that the Apex fits better and cradles my weight in the center better where as the Cat chassis puts my weight on the back more and lightens the front end as well as lifts it up higher making the sled for me a top heavy light front ended sled. Plus every bump keeps wanting to shove me forward towards the cowl so I constantly have to reposition myself to ride where I'm comfortable. So from a big guy standpoint the Apex is perfect the Winder not so much. Only worry I have about boosted sleds is just how much was it boosted to and what issues does a used sled have. New sled your the only one who has screwed with it so a fresh slate. Either way you can get help here!
 
OK Sled_ed,which one did you get? Let us know before the snow arrives ok. You cant go wrong with either sled,thats for sure.
 
I'd go buy a used Ski Doo 1200. The Sidewinder needs lots of work to get it where it's reliable and a trustworthy heavy tank, the Apex is just a rough riding old heavy tank. Excellent front end on the Winder! The 1200 Doo is an extremely lightweight four-stroke that will have the power to compete with a 150 HP Apex with just a few mods, and if you get a 2o16 or newer it can run close to a modded Apex with just a clutch swap. I've had many of them all, RX-1's, Apexs both old and power steering, 1200's and turbo cats along with a Winder. The best handling is my Winder and it has the very best front end on it. The funnest and fastest machines have always been my 1200's and I always come back smiling on the Doo, sometimes even laughing. I did have one very fast turbo Apex turbo, but it would wear you out, heavy chassis and poor suspensions too, worst front end of all of them.

The 1200 Doo is one of the best, most reliable overall machines I've ever owned in NA or turbo form. I'd love to return to a 1200 if I could find a mint one. I'd swap my Winder for a good one and turbo it. The Winder is a love hate machine for me, the 1200's I've always loved and never ever hated. Apex is only good on a smooth big groomed trail, awful on any roughness, I'd never ride another Apex again myself, I'd give up riding first I think, they were good back in the day, but time has passed them by by quite a bit.
 
KnappAttack said:
I'd go buy a used Ski Doo 1200. The Sidewinder needs lots of work to get it where it's reliable and a trustworthy heavy tank, the Apex is just a rough riding old heavy tank. Excellent front end on the Winder! The 1200 Doo is an extremely lightweight four-stroke that will have the power to compete with a 150 HP Apex with just a few mods, and if you get a 2o16 or newer it can run close to a modded Apex with just a clutch swap. I've had many of them all, RX-1's, Apexs both old and power steering, 1200's and turbo cats along with a Winder. The best handling is my Winder and it has the very best front end on it. The funnest and fastest machines have always been my 1200's and I always come back smiling on the Doo, sometimes even laughing. I did have one very fast turbo Apex turbo, but it would wear you out, heavy chassis and poor suspensions too, worst front end of all of them.

The 1200 Doo is one of the best, most reliable overall machines I've ever owned in NA or turbo form. I'd love to return to a 1200 if I could find a mint one. I'd swap my Winder for a good one and turbo it. The Winder is a love hate machine for me, the 1200's I've always loved and never ever hated. Apex is only good on a smooth big groomed trail, awful on any roughness, I'd never ride another Apex again myself, I'd give up riding first I think, they were good back in the day, but time has passed them by by quite a bit.
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There is no doubt that you have a lot more experience with the sleds than I do, especially the high powered sleds, but I think your post points out the truth of the "to each his own" theory. I rode 2-stroke Polaris sleds for years, and they got progressively better suspensions and their handling improved, but I switched over to the 4-stroke Yamaha's 10 years ago, just for the engine, and never looked back. I had the Vector, not the Apex, but I loved it (once I found Snow Trackers to cure the handling issues). After 4 years on the Vector, I found myself praying that Yamaha would come up with a rider-forward chassis for its 4-stroke; I even dreamed about a Yamaha 4-stroke in a Polaris chassis. The Viper was literally the answer to my prayers. Last year my riding buddy got a Winder, and we are competitive enough that I couldn't be left behind, and got one for myself. I only have a little over 2,000 miles on the Winder, but it has surpassed every expectation I had for it. Maybe it is the power and acceleration that I am not used to, but to me it feels light as a feather on the trail. I have Snow Trackers and the steering is light and positive with little or no push in the corners. I had a few 200+ mile days last year (one of almost 300), and despite being 68 years old, I never felt worn out, or not ready for the next day, and more miles, even with beat up trails. I can think of many words that describe my Winder, but "tank" is definitely not one of them.
 
You guys crack me up!! Until I gave it away the end of last season my ride for the last four years was a 96’ skidoo with the original sc-10. I’ve rode many a days 180+ miles in the U.P. And lower. And didn’t feel bad the next day. I’m 41 now and this year found a 2015 vector for a decent price. I sincerely hope you guys are wrong and that this 19 year newer sled is not going to ride worse than a worn out skidoo!! My friends have a venture, and apex’s. I went with the vector for the ease of working on them and the fact that my friends have had very few issues that weren’t self induced. Sit on either sled and not for like 30 seconds. Take your time and really sit on each model for at least 10 min. Sales people might look at you but when buying something you will have for years don’t mind them.
 
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Kenjeepman78 said:
You guys crack me up!! Until I gave it away the end of last season my ride for the last four years was a 96’ skidoo with the original sc-10. I’ve rode many a days 180+ miles in the U.P. And lower. And didn’t feel bad the next day. I’m 41 now and this year found a 2015 vector for a decent price. I sincerely hope you guys are wrong and that this 19 year newer sled is not going to ride worse than a worn out skidoo!! My friends have a venture, and apex’s. I went with the vector for the ease of working on them and the fact that my friends have had very few issues that weren’t self induced. Sit on either sled and not for like 30 seconds. Take your time and really sit on each model for at least 10 min. Sales people might look at you but when buying something you will have for years don’t mind them.
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When I was 46 years old, I rode my old 1994 Polaris Indy Sport for 150+ mile days, all winter long; unfortunately, at 68 years old, my knees and back are not as forgiving as they used to be. That having been said, after riding a 96' Skidoo with the SC-10 suspension, your Vector is going to ride like a Cadillac!
 
Wannaviper said:
When I was 46 years old, I rode my old 1994 Polaris Indy Sport for 150+ mile days, all winter long; unfortunately, at 68 years old, my knees and back are not as forgiving as they used to be. That having been said, after riding a 96' Skidoo with the SC-10 suspension, your Vector is going to ride like a Cadillac!
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I’m hoping so! And not smell like two cycle.
 
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