Yamaha done with sleds

[whitedust1]

Go on their website.
Nowhere does it say that they are an active engine supplier of any sort except for outboards.

That has nothing to do with growing any OEM business. Lol Think whatever you want on whatever level you prefer I’m thinking on a much higher level of growing OEM loss engine revenue than what an end user website advertises. Lol. You think like an end user not an OEM opportunist. Your stuck in the end user box which is fine but not what I’m discussing.

 

[journeyman]

I would be very surprised if Yamaha doesn’t have a sales team assigned to Polaris ,

I would be very surprised if Yamaha doesn’t have a sales team assigned to Textron,Polaris and BRP. That’s standard procedure for any OEM looking to grow and expand their business.

For what it’s worth I work with an engineer that left Polaris less than a year ago. Polaris had one of their test mule chassis using a 998T in it to compare to another identical chassis with their RZR turbo engine. Not sure any inner details but all he said was the Yamaha engine version destroyed the RZR engine one. One can only speculate what that was all about. He said it wasn’t his project so he didn’t know the inner details. This was just last year though.

 

[Upstater57]

Examples from the seventies....?

Yes, those are from the 1970's except for Suzuki which supplied engines to Acat until 2017 when Yamaha supplied the 998.

 

[whitedust1]

For what it’s worth I work with an engineer that left Polaris less than a year ago. Polaris had one of their test mule chassis using a 998T in it to compare to another identical chassis with their RZR turbo engine. Not sure any inner details but all he said was the Yamaha engine version destroyed the RZR engine one. One can only speculate what that was all about. He said it wasn’t his project so he didn’t know the inner details. This was just last year though.

Yep that’s how it’s starts exchange information and technical details write off an engine or 2 support the customer during the integration and test and hope the integration kicks #*$&@ compared to in-house or competitors engine. This indicates Polaris is shopping for 4s engine applications and Yamaha wants to sell engines to Polaris. If it makes financial sense the OEM relationship begins.

 

[earthling]

Examples from the seventies....?

Yamaha supplied engines to volvo for the XC90 up to 2012 but the engine is available today direct from Yamaha. They also supplied engines to Toyota for the LFA during that same timeframe. They also tune and modify engines for toyota today. They were producing entire prototype cars for Gordon Murray up until 2019 which of course included a Yamaha powerplant. They made a decision around 2019 to put all their new development energy into emerging markets and now are designing electric powerplants for themselves and other companies. They are also focused on UAV and robotics markets where they feel that their engineering skills can be applied to future growth markets. On the Yamaha corporate site in Japan they talk about partnering with them to leverage not only their supply chain logistics but their go to market skillset. Like kawasaki and others, Japanese powerplants are always going to be available for purchase which is why you see suzuki, kawi, yamaha, and honda powerplants in other vendors products. Is Yamaha making a big effort to do this.. no, primarily because they tend to focus on specialty markets whereas Honda and Suzuki manufacture more for the consumer market.

Japanese companies in general like to work together to share risk. You see this in the domestic car market in Japan where the mini trucks there are all built to a specific set of designs and can have powerplants from 6 different manufacturers (all bolt-in). For the future forward markets the Japanese companies like to collaborate based on a shared strength philosophy where each company is delegated a role which aligns to its core strength. I would not be surprised to see future Toyota or other manufacturer electric vehicles powered by Yamaha technology.

 

[stgdz]

For what it’s worth I work with an engineer that left Polaris less than a year ago. Polaris had one of their test mule chassis using a 998T in it to compare to another identical chassis with their RZR turbo engine. Not sure any inner details but all he said was the Yamaha engine version destroyed the RZR engine one. One can only speculate what that was all about. He said it wasn’t his project so he didn’t know the inner details. This was just last year though.

I hear the same thing from an engineer. There is some sort of a triple cylinder development going on. He said it's more the program managers are trying to get management to make a triple 4s.


With the death of the 998 that program is probably done for and they will just keep building boosts.

 

[stgdz]

Oh, you can't get a crate 998 either.


Has anyone kept up on the 1100 and part availability?

 

[Mototown]

Read the first paragraph from Yamaha Japan. They are basically saying the long term development of snowmobiles & emissions is not sustainable. Motocross bikes ( which is where Yamaha has a lot of personal interest ) are going to go through big changes in the next 10 years , as I think fossil motors will be banned. They will be perusing environment friendly products battery & hydrogen motors . Test Battery Mx bikes are competitive already with gas burning motors. Unfortunately for snowmobiles , winter , long range & batteries don’t mix very well . The average age of a snowmobiler 40-50 . Then dealing with Arctic cat to make sleds , put a bunch of these factors together, Yamaha is predicting the sport is going to die or not be profitable with current direction governments are going.

 

[biffdotorg]

Just look at their website and all the products they offer. All of their products are completely Yamaha aside from the sled which is ending. Outboards are the sole exception, but they are complete units in various sizes designed to bolt onto the back of most outboard boats.

I see they took down their go-cart engine supplier page on yamaha-motor. That was an exception for the longest time.

 

[74Nitro]

Yamaha supplied engines to volvo for the XC90 up to 2012 but the engine is available today direct from Yamaha. They also supplied engines to Toyota for the LFA during that same timeframe. They also tune and modify engines for toyota today. They were producing entire prototype cars for Gordon Murray up until 2019 which of course included a Yamaha powerplant. They made a decision around 2019 to put all their new development energy into emerging markets and now are designing electric powerplants for themselves and other companies. They are also focused on UAV and robotics markets where they feel that their engineering skills can be applied to future growth markets. On the Yamaha corporate site in Japan they talk about partnering with them to leverage not only their supply chain logistics but their go to market skillset. Like kawasaki and others, Japanese powerplants are always going to be available for purchase which is why you see suzuki, kawi, yamaha, and honda powerplants in other vendors products. Is Yamaha making a big effort to do this.. no, primarily because they tend to focus on specialty markets whereas Honda and Suzuki manufacture more for the consumer market.

Japanese companies in general like to work together to share risk. You see this in the domestic car market in Japan where the mini trucks there are all built to a specific set of designs and can have powerplants from 6 different manufacturers (all bolt-in). For the future forward markets the Japanese companies like to collaborate based on a shared strength philosophy where each company is delegated a role which aligns to its core strength. I would not be surprised to see future Toyota or other manufacturer electric vehicles powered by Yamaha technology.

Yes, they also supplied Ford with an engine for the Taurus at one time.
I still think that the little bit of engine supplying they do would be a tiny fraction of revenue for them compared to all the revenue they have on their complete product offering on a global scale.
While Yamaha does build a good engine, they are no better than anyone else IMO. There are many, many companies capable of building engines every bit as good, and some better.
In addition, in road racing they have struggling for years and years to achieve the horsepower levels of competitors in World Super bike and MotoGP.
In fact, they are the lowest in HP in both of those series. The BMW of Cameron Beaubier blows the doors off of the Yamaha in Moto America.

 

[Doc Harley]

I wonder if it's a good time to purchase a dozen or so, undesirable winders?
$200 here, $1,000 there. Hmmm

JT parts & service....

 

[whitedust1]

Read the first paragraph from Yamaha Japan. They are basically saying the long term development of snowmobiles & emissions is not sustainable. Motocross bikes ( which is where Yamaha has a lot of personal interest ) are going to go through big changes in the next 10 years , as I think fossil motors will be banned. They will be perusing environment friendly products battery & hydrogen motors . Test Battery Mx bikes are competitive already with gas burning motors. Unfortunately for snowmobiles , winter , long range & batteries don’t mix very well . The average age of a snowmobiler 40-50 . Then dealing with Arctic cat to make sleds , put a bunch of these factors together, Yamaha is predicting the sport is going to die or not be profitable with current direction governments are going.

Very probable in the long term. Trail closures are individual nails in the coffin too. So sad but true and I feel fortunate I lived thru the Haydays of snowmobiling.

 

[Richard Hodgins]

Oh, you can't get a crate 998 either.


Has anyone kept up on the 1100 and part availability?

THIS!

Even though Suzuki no longer supplies the engines for early procross, its still really easy to get parts for them from Arctic Cat. Yamaha exiting doesnt bother me at all, I was always a Cat guy and had an 1100 before the 998. I actually prefer the cat clutching on the 998 so its moot that
arctic cat isnt building blue ones anymore. It's just a motor supplier, no different than Suzuki was in the 2012-2106 models.
So cat will have the 998 until 2025....and it will be then end of the procross in my opinion. Catalyst may have 4stroke offerings and who knows what motor.
Now if CAT is leaving the industry, that will be MUCH worse!

 

[Mototown]

Yes, they also supplied Ford with an engine for the Taurus at one time.
I still think that the little bit of engine supplying they do would be a tiny fraction of revenue for them compared to all the revenue they have on their complete product offering on a global scale.
While Yamaha does build a good engine, they are no better than anyone else IMO. There are many, many companies capable of building engines every bit as good, and some better.
In addition, in road racing they have struggling for years and years to achieve the horsepower levels of competitors in World Super bike and MotoGP.
In fact, they are the lowest in HP in both of those series. The BMW of Cameron Beaubier blows the doors off of the Yamaha in Moto America.

 

[earthling]

Yes, they also supplied Ford with an engine for the Taurus at one time.
I still think that the little bit of engine supplying they do would be a tiny fraction of revenue for them compared to all the revenue they have on their complete product offering on a global scale.
While Yamaha does build a good engine, they are no better than anyone else IMO. There are many, many companies capable of building engines every bit as good, and some better.
In addition, in road racing they have struggling for years and years to achieve the horsepower levels of competitors in World Super bike and MotoGP.
In fact, they are the lowest in HP in both of those series. The BMW of Cameron Beaubier blows the doors off of the Yamaha in Moto America.

Agree on all but one point. Yamaha has manufacturing capacity, as does Honda and Suzuki. It only takes one look in the rear view mirror at the covid years to understand how critical supply chain management and manufacturing capacity are.

On a side note since I know you are a fan. That was quite the gift that Quartararo got at Assen.