2005 Vector - steel rear skid shock

[twomorestrokes]

I'm afraid that I tend to agree. We are all sorry that you are unhappy with your sled. Getting personal with other members because they like theirs isn't helping get your issues resolved. Your comments about the quality of the rear shock may be valid, but it doesn't sound like the shock is the cause of your stiff ride complaint.

What brand or model is a good riding trail sled in your opinion?

 

[YaMon]

Well put 2more!

 

[Groomerdriver]

Undecided - I do not know what I said or did to you, but you sure are a negative person looking for a fight. Do not knock what other people have bought and riden in the past. Those sleds that I paid hard cash for where great sleds at thier time and some of them still are. The Vector I ride to date is the best riding sled that I have owned. I am sorry that you feel your sled rides to harsh and is a disappointment to you. To most every Vector owner on here, this is a great sled. I would recommend that you sell your Vector and buy another sled. Life is to short. Wish you luck! :ORC

You didn't do anything Oak, I asked for it and I got it, and I can live with that. Negative..no..but I have my bad days like everybody else. As long as you were happy, that's what it's all about....being happy with the sled you own(ed). I have no doubt that you feel that the Vector is the best riding sled you've ever owned...maybe I should have put it that way. COMPARED to other trail cruisers I've owned, and buying into the Yami hype about how this sled was supposed to ride, the skid is a disappointment. I LOVE everything else about the sled, and I've stated this publicly many times. It IS a good sled, and like I've told others, put in a Mono/M10/Expert X and you could have the sled of the century!

I'm a cancer survivor from earlier in the year and have already had to sell off two other sleds to pay bills. Notice I said that I sold two other sleds...not the Vector. If I could afford a M10 I'd buy one today and put it in tomorrow, but I can't right now. My intention is to keep the sled, do the best with the skid in it's stock form, and buy the M10 when we're outta the hole we're in. BTW - not to be a smart aleck but why is it I see so many people putting M10's/Expert X's/etc in their brand new Vectors, Apex's/RX-1's? Many other people must feel like I do that they rear skid is lacking...which has been Yami's problem for years.

Earlier this year, I stared "mortality" in the face, and learned how really short life can be.

Enjoy the riding, and the best of luck back at 'cha!

 

[Groomerdriver]

I'm afraid that I tend to agree. We are all sorry that you are unhappy with your sled. Getting personal with other members because they like theirs isn't helping get your issues resolved. Your comments about the quality of the rear shock may be valid, but it doesn't sound like the shock is the cause of your stiff ride complaint.

What brand or model is a good riding trail sled in your opinion?

If you feel that I was getting personal with Oak, boy there are some boards that you better not ever go to! This board (ty.com) is known in the internet community as being soft and nothing but a "Yamaha is the best and don't argue with us" place. We'll, I'm going to argue a bit and maybe push some hot buttons to get people thinking. When I start telling people to GGF'd or that they're a SOB, that's crossing a line that I'll never go over.

I was brand loyal for a long time, but never brand blind. Until the Vector came along, Yami never offered something I wanted, neither did Doo.

I need to ride my Vector after the dealer made the valving changes. I'm starting to think that the combination of the hyd shock with the gas shock has much to do with my ride issues. (maybe a Fox PPS/Ryde FX combo would be the ticket!!) The spring rates on the torsions and front shocks may be off a bit. Couple this all with the transfer rod settings that affect the coupling, and you have a very twitchy/touchy skid. My dealer as much as said this yesterday. He wishes that Yami would come out with a GOOD suspension tuning handbook for the Vector's and especially the Mono skids. He's seeing people play with things and getting everything totally screwed up.

As to a good riding trail sled, IMO nowadays you have to break down "trail" sleds in "performance" and "luxury/cruising". My preference is the latter category, and as a friend suggested to me, maybe the Vector should be classified as a trail performace sled like the RX-1/Apex is. Is it possible I bought the wrong sled for my type of riding (crusing/touring/distance)? Maybe, but Yami marketed the sled as being that type of sled, the Apex as the trail crotch rocket, and I got sold on the marketing.

To finally answer your question, for my type of riding give me any sled with a properly setup M10, any Cat with the ZL chassis, any Polaris with the Xtra12 skid, any 2-up Polaris (setup for 1-up riding) with the Edge Touring suspension. I've haven't put on enough miles on the Mono or Xpert X skids to have an opinion.

How about if we all could get off of these f'ing computers and go riding??? That would help my attitude a great deal!!!!

 

[twomorestrokes]

I am also a member of many of those other boards that you advise me not to go to... snowmobileworld, HSC, Sledheads, Dootalk, Fullsize Chevy forum, Automotiveforums.com etc. (maybe it's time to spend more time working at work ) This forum is very refreshing, as it is cordial and constructive, very well set up and it is very effectively moderated. I have gained a TON of knowledge here about my sled and actually feels like friends here. People know what they are talking about and know the brand instead of just shooting the breeze like the other forums. I found this forum last winter after using a search engine trying to find out about the TORS issue that kept ruining my day. Some of those other forums actually allow the members to tell each other to "GGFed" very blatently, and I spend little time there. That ain't right and it turns into a big waste of time. You don't need to push hot buttons to get us thinking. Nothing wrong with constructive criticism though along with helpful discussion as to what others have done with similar issues.

Yamaha is not the only brand that has the coupling thing, just a different way of doing it. Some Cat owners need to buy a kit just to get theirs to couple. The ProActive suspension is not that complicated, but the correct adjustments need to be made and need to work along with the others. All brand suspensions are equally as easy to screw up by improper adjustments. Are you sure your dealer knows what he's doing?

As far as the suggestion that Yamaha classify the Vector as a trail performance sled, that IS how they classify it. Check www.yamaha-motor.com. The Venture is the touring/ distance machine. Every company makes great sleds. F7's are a good riding sled that deserves a lot of respect. Revs are really something to watch out for on the rough trails. I suppose even a Polaris has some good points. (oops) I am probably going to change my shocks eventually to clickers, but IMO that is the name of the game when you're into sledding. I do the same with my cars and trucks to make them perform better than they did.

Anyway, I'm done. You seem like a nice guy and I'm not ragging on you. Just answering your post that was directed to me. Sorry for being long winded, but it's just another character flaw. Ask my wife.

 

[RSVECTORFREAK]

All good points here but I tend to think that for lighter drivers the skid is adequate but for heavier riders , the skid really needs to be upgraded. I too would really like to experiment with Ohlins and revalves and etc but I think I am leaning towards the expert x avenue myself. For trail crusing in which it was intended, not a bad ride at all, get in the whoops and you might as well clinch up and take it like a man or be the last one at the next bar stop.

 

[Groomerdriver]

I am also a member of many of those other boards that you advise me not to go to... snowmobileworld, HSC, Sledheads, Dootalk, Fullsize Chevy forum, Automotiveforums.com etc. (maybe it's time to spend more time working at work ) This forum is very refreshing, as it is cordial and constructive, very well set up and it is very effectively moderated. I have gained a TON of knowledge here about my sled and actually feels like friends here. People know what they are talking about and know the brand instead of just shooting the breeze like the other forums. I found this forum last winter after using a search engine trying to find out about the TORS issue that kept ruining my day. Some of those other forums actually allow the members to tell each other to "GGFed" very blatently, and I spend little time there. That ain't right and it turns into a big waste of time. You don't need to push hot buttons to get us thinking. Nothing wrong with constructive criticism though along with helpful discussion as to what others have done with similar issues.

Yamaha is not the only brand that has the coupling thing, just a different way of doing it. Some Cat owners need to buy a kit just to get theirs to couple. The ProActive suspension is not that complicated, but the correct adjustments need to be made and need to work along with the others. All brand suspensions are equally as easy to screw up by improper adjustments. Are you sure your dealer knows what he's doing?

As far as the suggestion that Yamaha classify the Vector as a trail performance sled, that IS how they classify it. Check www.yamaha-motor.com. The Venture is the touring/ distance machine. Every company makes great sleds. F7's are a good riding sled that deserves a lot of respect. Revs are really something to watch out for on the rough trails. I suppose even a Polaris has some good points. (oops) I am probably going to change my shocks eventually to clickers, but IMO that is the name of the game when you're into sledding. I do the same with my cars and trucks to make them perform better than they did.

Anyway, I'm done. You seem like a nice guy and I'm not ragging on you. Just answering your post that was directed to me. Sorry for being long winded, but it's just another character flaw. Ask my wife.

I think I should spend more time working too!!! My opinion of this site was just that..my opinion. Maybe coming over here this year was too much of a "soft core" shock for me!!! I could go on and on but all I'm gonna do is get my BP up and people PO'd, which is not me nor my intent.

I AM PASSIONATE ABOUT THE SPORT..period end of story, and my passion gets the best of me sometimes! Get me started about loud pipes, trail closures, landowner issues....wo boy!!! that really gets me going. Oh yea...my wife says I'm one big character flaw!!!

As to "my dealer", that's for a whole nother time. This "dealer" has two locations, and the sled is now at location #2 whicj has the guys that really know Yami suspensions, shocks, etc.

On to more important things....my sled and the changes. Today dealer #2 completed the revalving work. Guy my weight took it out for a ride. He knows what my goal is as to ride quality. Before and after revalving the middle shock softer, he's finding that the spring is too soft for what I want. Apparently the middle shock has been bottoming due to the type of shock it is, and it's not a good one for my type of riding regardless of valving (trying to keep it simple). More agressive riding it's fine I guess. THis is where some/most of harshness is coming from he says. So he's going to put in a dual rate spring that he's familiar with out of a Viper.

Hope I explained this in a manner that makes sense! Hopefully I can go pick it up alone and take it for a little ride! Will keep y'all posted!

 

[Oak Hill]

Undecided - will be interested in hearing how the changes your Dealer made works out for you. I also do not understand why the manufactures went away from dual rate springs, they are excellent for ride and performance. If your a pure ditch banger then straight rate springs. For trail cruising and performance sleds, Dual Rate Springs are the ticket. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Groomerdriver]

Put about 5 miles on the new setup yesterday. Trails were bumnped up pretty good. Not stutters, just mini moguls. Not enough snow to groom, but trails were rideable.

Biggest thing I noticed was the front end much MUCH BETTER in the bumps. I could see the front going thru the travel vs before the front would travel very little and hit you hard in the handlebars. Dealer took out 4 compression shims and added 1 rebound shim. He tightened the spring just a bit. As before, the sled corners just fine...as I get more miles on in different conditions, I may play with the springs a little bit. A bigger sway bar remains a possibility, but right now I dont think I need one.

Now to the skid. THe progressive rate spring in the front has removed some of the harshness in the skid. Dealer revalved the shock just a bit softer (it was pretty soft already he said) and changed the stack so it would react differently as the speeds increased. Some of you may understand what he did to the stack to do this...I don't.

It might be that some peoples complaints about bottoming are more related to the front spring being too soft and it's not working with the back real well. Dealer said that the stock spring, regardless of shock valving, is way too soft for the skid. A good investment for some of you that say the skid is too soft would be a progressive rate spring. I dont know the Yami P/N for the prog rate spring I now have but can find out if you'd like me too. Interesting that dealer said that if it's too soft in front, valving the shock stiffer will make it ride MUCH worse. He doesnt want to valve it any stiffer. He wants me to play with the spring tension. If I cant get this spring tight enough, he'll look for a stiffer prog rate spring.

What is becoming much clearer is that the rear shock is a real weak link in the capability of this skid. Changing the front track setup has reduced the rebound kick in the back, but not enough. He's not conviced that a $400 Ohlins is the answer. A Nytro shock will fit, but it's $500, and again may not be the answer. If one could find a Comet PSS or Fox PSS shock that would fit, that could be the ticket. I have emails in to Fox, Ryde FX and two well known shock places (Deycore and B-Line) and have given them the rear shock specs. Maybe they'll have a cost effective idea.

Before I forget, I tried the rear cams on both M and H, and felt little if any difference. Left them on H to gain more travel inches before the skid couples.

Here's where I'm setup now on the skid: Prog rate spring with collar compressing spring 2/3rds with 1/3 thread left. Cams on H, and transfer rods have 1 line or less to full transfer.

FWIW - I THINK the front end (ski shocks) of the sled now being softer/more compliant is going to help this sled be much more enjoyable for me to ride. I would just get pounded with vibrations the the bars int he stutters and small bumps. I've got my fingers crossed!!!!!

 

[sicilien]

What is becoming much clearer is that the rear shock is a real weak link in the capability of this skid. Changing the front track setup has reduced the rebound kick in the back, but not enough. He's not conviced that a $400 Ohlins is the answer. A Nytro shock will fit, but it's $500, and again may not be the answer. If one could find a Comet PSS or Fox PSS shock that would fit, that could be the ticket. I have emails in to Fox, Ryde FX and two well known shock places (Deycore and B-Line) and have given them the rear shock specs. Maybe they'll have a cost effective idea.

Did you get any news from deycore or b-line for the shock ??

 

[Groomerdriver]

What is becoming much clearer is that the rear shock is a real weak link in the capability of this skid. Changing the front track setup has reduced the rebound kick in the back, but not enough. He's not conviced that a $400 Ohlins is the answer. A Nytro shock will fit, but it's $500, and again may not be the answer. If one could find a Comet PSS or Fox PSS shock that would fit, that could be the ticket. I have emails in to Fox, Ryde FX and two well known shock places (Deycore and B-Line) and have given them the rear shock specs. Maybe they'll have a cost effective idea.

Did you get any news from deycore or b-line for the shock ??

yes - Deycore will custom build you a HPG (no clicker(s)) for $265. send them the stock shock, or exact dimensions they need. call Jim @ Deycore. FYI - if you wait till summer Jim said thay'd take 15% off.

I ended up with a Nytro shock......wont say how much..all i'll say is that it was less than $265. SHock is too stiff on the compression side..gonna have it revalved.

 

[NY_Nytro]

Undecided - are your studs tightened fully? Buy the picture they look like they are not fully seated.

Studs look fine.

 

[pro116]

I will sell my ohlin rear shock.