Best Helix

[STAIN]

Straight 35 with Dalton wrapped to 90 degrees for me also. Works pretty well.
I would like to try a 39-35, but dont want to spend the ching on the experiment.

 

[KnappAttack]

Straight 35 with Dalton wrapped to 90 degrees for me also. Works pretty well.
I would like to try a 39-35, but dont want to spend the ching on the experiment.

You'll see low RPM at the start of the run for trail use with the 39-35. Great for ice dragging though.

 

[STAIN]

You'll see low RPM at the start of the run for trail use with the 39-35. Great for ice dragging though.

Yeah, I am trying to control a bit of an overflash down low. I am nitpicking at this point.

 

[Janne339]

Straight 35 with Dalton wrapped to 90 degrees for me also. Works pretty well.
I would like to try a 39-35, but dont want to spend the ching on the experiment.

Are you still running the heelclickers in your primary?

I have a set of heavy hitters since my Viper turbo. Gonna test them on my Sidewinder. My new Sidewinders stock helix is reverse 35/39 with pink Yamaha spring and it don't work so good with the heavy hitters.

On my Viper turbo I have good luck with progressive helix and old cat yellow spring. What I can see nowone sell Dalton springs in Sweden? Only TP, Yamaha and the old cat springs.

 

[jonlafon1]

What weigths in primary?

I have mostly read negative reviews about TP orange. Great it works for you! If you compare it with dalton black/orange in Dalton chart TP is almost equivalent to black/orange except torsion?

TP orange
Torsion 13 kg
Comp.load in kg: 29, 41, 55

Dalton black/orange
Torsion 8,5 kg
Comp.load in kg: 31, 43, 52

Heavy hitters. From thunder products. Lightest weight in primary of anyone on this site I’m guessing. I prefer lighter weights in primary. The hitters act heavier then they are. Heels loaded, middle empty. Tips loaded. A lot of good recipes on here. I’m at 10k for miles on this set up. Stock clutches. 911 cover.

 

[putz21]

Straight 35 with Dalton wrapped to 90 degrees for me also. Works pretty well.
I would like to try a 39-35, but dont want to spend the ching on the experiment.

I am also running the Straight 35. With the Dalton B/O wrapped to 90 with the XS825 belt, do you find the clutch temps too warm? I am using Dalton B/O wrapped to 80 with XS825 belt and don't appear to have the belt slipping. I had originally thought wrapped at 90 might be too much for the XS825 belt, but looks like probably not.

 

[STAIN]

Are you still running the heelclickers in your primary?

No. I wore set out on the stock tune in 600 miles. They are made of #*$&@ material and the owner, Randy Nouis, dosent seem to care. There is a company in Sweden that makes what appears to be a similar design with much better material. The design works.

I am also running the Straight 35. With the Dalton B/O wrapped to 90 with the XS825 belt, do you find the clutch temps too warm? I am using Dalton B/O wrapped to 80 with XS825 belt and don't appear to have the belt slipping. I had originally thought wrapped at 90 might be too much for the XS825 belt, but looks like probably not.

clutch temps are good on mine. I dont have numbers but I am satisfied where they are. I might try 80 degree wrap.

 

[Snowaddict]

Are you still running the heelclickers in your primary?

I have a set of heavy hitters since my Viper turbo. Gonna test them on my Sidewinder. My new Sidewinders stock helix is reverse 35/39 with pink Yamaha spring and it don't work so good with the heavy hitters.

On my Viper turbo I have good luck with progressive helix and old cat yellow spring. What I can see nowone sell Dalton springs in Sweden? Only TP, Yamaha and the old cat springs.

I'm probably a dinosaur in my setup, which is 35/39 helix, Orange TP primary, heavy hitters, and stock secondary wrapped at 6-1. This was the original helix recommendation by @NOS-PRO after the SW first came out. Due to my lack of being mechanically inclined @jonlafon1 did the install. That guy knows his $h!t btw. I also tried the TP orange secondary spring, but got hotter clutch temperatures than I was comfortable with. So, I went back to stock secondary spring. I have been afraid to try anything else because of the various issues these sleds have had and figure if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I mainly trail ride, though. So, my application may be different than others.

 

[74Nitro]

The reverse angle may actually work well with some of the new software available that allows the boost to start increasing at set speeds.

 

[SideHogger]

I am also running the Straight 35. With the Dalton B/O wrapped to 90 with the XS825 belt, do you find the clutch temps too warm? I am using Dalton B/O wrapped to 80 with XS825 belt and don't appear to have the belt slipping. I had originally thought wrapped at 90 might be too much for the XS825 belt, but looks like probably not.

I tried the stock 35 wrapped at 6/2 and also seemed like secondary running hot so went down to 6/1 and belt started slipping. Yes, XS825 also. So went back to 6/2. Didn’t try 6/3 afraid of even more heat.

 

[KnappAttack]

I tried the stock 35 wrapped at 6/2 and also seemed like secondary running hot so went down to 6/1 and belt started slipping. Yes, XS825 also. So went back to 6/2. Didn’t try 6/3 afraid of even more heat.

Let me ask you this, what rollers do you have in the secondary?

I found something quite interesting yesterday on my drill press scale. I've actually forgot some of the stuff I found out a year or two, maybe three years ago now.

I'm tuning up a new SRX in the shop this week so ordered up a 35 Dalton with a new V2 B/O spring. I checked it at zero on the clutch and it wanted to set down on the secondary with a 30 wrap. So I set it at 6&2 and threw it in the drip press scale and got a reading of 217-372 with it at 6&2. on a stock set of Yamaha rollers. Thats the highest recorded spring load I have ever run before. Even higher than when I was using the Cutler silver/white Cat spring a few years back using my Hi-Torque rollers. It's amazing to me how different all the rollers behave on the scale. I run 95* wrap on my V1 Dalton B/O Hi-torque rollers and only get 165-305 on my scale.

What I have found is if you do not have enough spring/secondary pressure on my scale the machine will not MPH well on the bigger tunes, and that is why I ran the heavier Cat springs when using the 8JP while using the Hi-Torque rollers. The XS825 can get by with less secondary pressure. Secondary pressure under acceleration is really affected by the secondary rollers you are using whether you believe it or not. Its why some are getting by with less spring and different helix's and what works for one will not work for another simply because of how the rollers roll.

 

[SideHogger]

I have the Hi-Torque. Same exact sled as yours also.

 

[STAIN]

What I have found is if you do not have enough spring/secondary pressure on my scale the machine will not MPH well on the bigger tunes

You run the 35 degree helix with B/o wrapped at 90 degrees correct? Are you saying this may be not enough to run big MPH if you run non stock rollers?
It gets into high gear too fast and wont pull correctly.......??
I run the Thunder product secondary rollers.
The stock rollers seem to "stick" and it takes more pressure to open? Would this not make more heat and decrease secondary efficiency?
I am trying to wrap my head around this. I tried a 40 degree helix last week on the lake with poor results, correct RPM but no mph or throttle response. I chalked it up to the secondary shifting up too quickly for the helix/ spring combo.
I also rode a 2019 ZR 9000 with the same tune as I have. Very similar sled. He is geared up to 21-38 vs my 21-41. His sled rolled much better on top and I chalked it up to the gear. I wonder now if the TEAM secondary is running more efficiently then my Yamaha secondary helping the Cat pull better top end also?

hoping to trail ride the next couple of days and will see how this new tune trail rides........

 

[Janne339]

Let me ask you this, what rollers do you have in the secondary?

I found something quite interesting yesterday on my drill press scale. I've actually forgot some of the stuff I found out a year or two, maybe three years ago now.

I'm tuning up a new SRX in the shop this week so ordered up a 35 Dalton with a new V2 B/O spring. I checked it at zero on the clutch and it wanted to set down on the secondary with a 30 wrap. So I set it at 6&2 and threw it in the drip press scale and got a reading of 217-372 with it at 6&2. on a stock set of Yamaha rollers. Thats the highest recorded spring load I have ever run before. Even higher than when I was using the Cutler silver/white Cat spring a few years back using my Hi-Torque rollers. It's amazing to me how different all the rollers behave on the scale. I run 95* wrap on my V1 Dalton B/O Hi-torque rollers and only get 165-305 on my scale.

What I have found is if you do not have enough spring/secondary pressure on my scale the machine will not MPH well on the bigger tunes, and that is why I ran the heavier Cat springs when using the 8JP while using the Hi-Torque rollers. The XS825 can get by with less secondary pressure. Secondary pressure under acceleration is really affected by the secondary rollers you are using whether you believe it or not. Its why some are getting by with less spring and different helix's and what works for one will not work for another simply because of how the rollers roll.

Thanks! Great information!

 

[KnappAttack]

You run the 35 degree helix with B/o wrapped at 90 degrees correct? Are you saying this may be not enough to run big MPH if you run non stock rollers?
It gets into high gear too fast and wont pull correctly.......??
I run the Thunder product secondary rollers.
The stock rollers seem to "stick" and it takes more pressure to open? Would this not make more heat and decrease secondary efficiency?
I am trying to wrap my head around this. I tried a 40 degree helix last week on the lake with poor results, correct RPM but no mph or throttle response. I chalked it up to the secondary shifting up too quickly for the helix/ spring combo.
I also rode a 2019 ZR 9000 with the same tune as I have. Very similar sled. He is geared up to 21-38 vs my 21-41. His sled rolled much better on top and I chalked it up to the gear. I wonder now if the TEAM secondary is running more efficiently then my Yamaha secondary helping the Cat pull better top end also?

hoping to trail ride the next couple of days and will see how this new tune trail rides........

That is what I'm saying. I was at 95 degrees wrap today because I have my Helix's drilled with add 5* holes, on a V1 B/O with stock 35* helix and killed TWO XS belts upon switching to the 300 HP tune. It scaled at 165-303 and you could see the RPM climb pretty high at speeds starting up over 100 MPH on the logs as I look at them. For comparison, the SRX secondary I set at 80 with the new V2 on 35* is 217-372 on stock rollers. And I actually tested it this AM when the shop was cold at 218-402. That is some extreme side pressure and its just a V2 set at 80 on a 35 helix! I keep testing it because I can't believe its as high as it is. I remember when I switched to the Hi-Torque rollers in, I was forced to lighten up on the primary weight a bunch! They messed up my whole clutch package and I started to eat belts again after I thought I had an handle on belt blowing.

Its no wonder we are all over the board on these things! Without me testing on the drill press scale I'd never know how the secondary rollers affect the secondary side pressure! Throw the charts all out the window because they mean nothing with dealing with different rollers, torsion spring twist, etc.

The side pressure means everything to the belt and slippage vs. no slippage. It's why testing on a drill press scale accurately, means so much.

More helix, higher number = less secondary pressure.
Less spring wrap = less secondary pressure.
Easier to roll better rollers = less secondary pressure.

"Sticking", "binding rollers" like the stock Yamaha rollers in my drill press scale make for much higher scale numbers at the start, and even more so at the finish compared to the easy rolling Hi-Torque rollers. So Hi-Torque rollers need much stiffer springs and wraps to equal lighter springs as the stock Yamaha rollers do on the scale. I'm to the point of possibly going back to the sticky Yamaha rollers to apply more secondary pressure, or maybe going back to the heavy Cat springs, even on the XS 825. The XS does not show signs of slippage in the clutches like the 8JP or 8DN other than to just shine up the clutch faces. I have a new Gates Redline belt coming to try as well, we'll se how that one does.

I've done everything I can to lighten things up to make life easier on the primary rollers and make them last longer, but it might just be time to go back to a heavier secondary setup with more side force.

Two XS belts blown in less than 15 min today. I felt one was a freak thing, then the second went 10 min later. Its not pretty. The SAGA continues for the perfect balance and belt longevity. These two XS belts both have about 600 miles on them. And yes, they line up with the Hurricane bar perfectly, however I was allowing 1.5 mm of float which could also contribute to a mis-alignment. I find floating when under power to stick outward on hard acceleration, I may go back to locking the secondary down for no float again too.