my XTX setup, ride and review

[NOS-PRO]

2 videos of how the sled reacts in the powder. The Viper just growls and stands up on command with the new clutch setup.

1st one was Saturday, 43 straight (stock) helix pink spring set at 3-3

2nd one is Sunday, 45/39 helix with pink set at 3-3

The engine just has so much grunt now, what a blast to ride!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxhDd7pZjI0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpgrSx2HNYE

 

[Apex1958]

Thanks for the info I called my dealer and he says the weights in the XTX are different from the LTX he says the LTX has the same weights as the Nytro. He is using Heavy Hitter clutch set up with a 47/41 helix and the 8DN belt and is seeing a consistent 95 MPH in the field he has behind his dealer ship. He is working with a dissatisfied customer and the two of them together have come up with a good set up. Between the dyno and actual running of the sled they are happy, but what’s most important is that he can make Yamaha see there is an issue here with the clutching.
I like this sled a lot it’s just to slow I have 2300 miles and except going through and some growing pains it’s been a good sled. Now I can live with a consistent 95 MPH.

 

[NOS-PRO]

I had a set of HH's, sold them to a guy I know....wish I had them back.

I will be playing with the 8FP weights yet....need to get it to 8,900 maximum rpm.

 

[stingray719]

Thanks for the info I called my dealer and he says the weights in the XTX are different from the LTX he says the LTX has the same weights as the Nytro. He is using Heavy Hitter clutch set up with a 47/41 helix and the 8DN belt and is seeing a consistent 95 MPH in the field he has behind his dealer ship. He is working with a dissatisfied customer and the two of them together have come up with a good set up. Between the dyno and actual running of the sled they are happy, but what’s most important is that he can make Yamaha see there is an issue here with the clutching.
I like this sled a lot it’s just to slow I have 2300 miles and except going through and some growing pains it’s been a good sled. Now I can live with a consistent 95 MPH.

Hmmm..... go to yamaha motorsports and look at the parts fiche. It shows same 8gl on the LTX as on the XTX. I am not trying to be an #*$&@ just trying to keep facts in play. Only diff I know of is some can have diff rivets as per altitude.

http://www.yamahamotorsports.com/partvi ... SNOWMOBILE)/PRIMARY_SHEAVE_(SR10LEB_-_2014)

 

[Apex1958]

719 You are right he did say the weight was 8GL and he said that is the same as the NYRO.

 

[stingray719]

719 You are right he did say the weight was 8GL and he said that is the same as the NYRO.

You are correct, and the Nytro also could come with 8FS weights if it was a Mountain sled (MTX)

http://www.yamahamotorsports.com/partvi ... SNOWMOBILE)/PRIMARY_SHEAVE_(FX10M53SZL_-_2010)

All 3 boosted Yamahas I had/have had to go to 8FS weights to get them to run correctly. But that is just what I did. The 8FP weight is alot like the 8FS I may try that next time.

 

[NOS-PRO]

719 You are right he did say the weight was 8GL and he said that is the same as the NYRO.

You are correct, and the Nytro also could come with 8FS weights if it was a Mountain sled (MTX)

http://www.yamahamotorsports.com/partvi ... SNOWMOBILE)/PRIMARY_SHEAVE_(FX10M53SZL_-_2010)

All 3 boosted Yamahas I had/have had to go to 8FS weights to get them to run correctly. But that is just what I did. The 8FP weight is alot like the 8FS I may try that next time.

 

[stingray719]

Video of me darn near ramming my Nytro

Gave my son 4 lengths and before letting off I was 2 lengths in front of him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeiNuxIomcE

This was proven many times over and over

With the stock viper primary and 47/40 helix with the Pink set at 3-3, I would get my Nytro about 2 lengths so this setup is working great! My Nytro is picked 144 down the center and has a newer well broken in belt. The Nytro sees 100+ consistantly on the speedo

Thanks again Bill!!!

Same results I saw after the clutch change. Now we need to get Yamaha to listen to us!

 

[NOS-PRO]

 

[NOS-PRO]

Updating with latest results......

Front shocks - 65 lbs.

Rear shock - 130lbs. (Going up another 5 lbs. as the new clutching makes the front end come up a lot higher....need to tame it down a bit. On the trail coming out of the corners...the skis are in the air a little too much for too long)

Center shock - 14 threads showing now

Limiter straps - 3rd hole from top (middle hole)

Stock Primary unmachined - 8FP weights, G/W/G primary spring with 2mm spacer, rollers stock

Secondary stock unmachined - Pink stock spring set at 3-3, 45/39 helix. 8mm bolts removed from back of secondary

8DN belt with 1,500+ miles

 

[blade072]

Stain, the stock 43 straight will hit the rev limiter unless you are on extreme hard pack.

Ulmer is a good helix to run but set your pink spring at 3-3 with either helix

Another thing is my belt has quite a few miles on it, if you have a new or newer 8DN, give it a try, it might be right at 8,900 for ya!

I own a 2011 Apex XTX, but have been watching this site as I may purchase a Viper at some point.
Go to the Apex site and look at the thread on problems with the secondary spring by blade072.
The pink spring is the stock spring for the XTX.
I could not get top speed out of the sled so I did some investigating and found that the pink spring will not let the secondary clutches open all the way, therefore the belt doesn't drop to the bottom of the sheaves.
The spring coils binds. You need to add spaces to the towers. I also machined the helix to allow the sheaves to open more.
I am not sure if the clutches are the same on the Viper as the Apex, but if they are, then you will get coil bind when using the pink spring which has a 6mm wire dia.
This just could be some of your clutching problems, top end, etc. that I have been reading about.
Jim

 

[NOS-PRO]

Jim, i will try that. But I think my aftermarket helix is cleared for that...maybe not. Good point tho! Thanks man!

I tried a green, a white, a silver and went back to the Pink.

Good Info and I appreciate everybody's comments

This Viper is starting to come around on top end. We have the bottom end taken care of now, it's a monster on take off! Closest sled is my Nytro out of anything I ran against. Even other Vipers with clutch kits.

 

[NOS-PRO]

Saturday, Shagman and I tried a bunch of things and wish he could have rode with me yesterday, but he had to leave. Trails Sunday were flat, groomed and set up which really made for different testing

Once again, pull apart, test, come back and pull apart and go test again.

Trails started out Saturday were very loose, lots of track spin and top speed was 94-95 as the trail was like a roller coaster with not washboard, but groomed ramps so to say and loose snow. Last week I was hitting the rev limiter so I thought I would try putting in a 3 gram rivot in the tip and try it, so I did. Shagman put a 3.7 in the middle and it didn't work, so I helped and we put in a 3.7 gram rivot in the tip also of his 8FP weights. I was a little low on rpm so I put a 3mm spacer in with my primary (previously was 2mm). Rpm's were a slight low at 8,650-8,720 but I wanted to wait for hardpack.

Our group of 5 drove 237 miles on Saturday and conditions went from loose snow to sticky, warm and slushy snow on the trails to mud on the logging roads with sound deep water puddles. Shagman and myself swapped sleds and his seemed to pull better on top end where mine was a monster on bottom end....but I was getting more mph on top which is weird...but none the less, 2 very quick sleds out of the hole. Andrew (my son on my Nytro) and I would line up and it was spin, spin, spin. The sleds were neck and neck after that, some me winning and some him winning. During our ride, we stopped to paly in the powder where both Shagman and myslef noticed the spring wrap on the secondary was too low and just sucked the belt down in the secondary. Was fun, but the deep snow was not as enjoyable with the belt slipping. Still, great fun and i got to see Shagman totally bury his sled on a hill....LMAO! When we arrived in Seney, I put on a new 8DN belt so I could break it in and try Saturday night and Sunday. The only great hook up I got was when Shagman dropped him arm and my XTX took off like a scared rabbit about 5 lengths in front of the Nytro. Tom (Mr Sled) took us on a road where I did back off and make a short run, I saw 106 but had a pucker moment when I saw everyone turning back onto the trail.

My setup now.... 8FP weights with a 3 gram rivot in the tip. G/W/G primary spring with a 3mm spacer, stock rollers. Secondary is Pink spring set at 6-1 with .080" washers under the helix which I kept the 45/39. 8DN belt
Rpm's were a max of 9,070

Shagman setup....8FP weights with a 3.7 rivot in the tip. 3mm spacer with a Y/G/Y spring, stock rollers. Secondary Pink spring set at 6-2 with washers under the 46/40 helix and 8DN belt.
Rpm's were a max of 9,150 where he said he was hitting the rev limiter.

Now, Sunday was a totally different situation as the warm weather and fresh grooming made trail 7 a slot car track. Skis in the air till 70 and hook like a mutha! Ran the smae setup but knocked it down to a wrap of 3-3 on the secondary. Better have 135 lbs. in that rear float as under power the skis are unless! Raced a few times and can say the Viper is back at it again with a maximum rpm of 8,940 - never hit the rev limiter and that oh so good freight train pull! Top speed on the trail was still just under 100 with the short runs I did and I know if there was a long enough path with hard crusted snow....107+ would be guaranteed. Talked to Allen Ulmer Friday and will be machining my clutches

The best part of this setup now is cruising speeds of 60 are at 6,700 rpm's which I am using a lot less fuel than the nytro. Back shift at 6-1 is very nice and it's a rocket from corner to corner with an awesome setup for 660 ft. snow drags. But, if you want top speed, the spring needs to be softened up as bottom end performance will give a little. My clutch mark is just a little better than it was last time, but I think the new belt....not the clutch setup helped with that. I think Allen is right with machining the primary to get better shift out.

 

[shagman]

Saturday, Shagman and I tried a bunch of things and wish he could have rode with me yesterday, but he had to leave. Trails Sunday were flat, groomed and set up which really made for different testing

Once again, pull apart, test, come back and pull apart and go test again.

Trails started out Saturday were very loose, lots of track spin and top speed was 94-95 as the trail was like a roller coaster with not washboard, but groomed ramps so to say and loose snow. Last week I was hitting the rev limiter so I thought I would try putting in a 3 gram rivot in the tip and try it, so I did. Shagman put a 3.7 in the middle and it didn't work, so I helped and we put in a 3.7 gram rivot in the tip also of his 8FP weights. I was a little low on rpm so I put a 3mm spacer in with my primary (previously was 2mm). Rpm's were a slight low at 8,650-8,720 but I wanted to wait for hardpack.

Our group of 5 drove 237 miles on Saturday and conditions went from loose snow to sticky, warm and slushy snow on the trails to mud on the logging roads with sound deep water puddles. Shagman and myself swapped sleds and his seemed to pull better on top end where mine was a monster on bottom end....but I was getting more mph on top which is weird...but none the less, 2 very quick sleds out of the hole. Andrew (my son on my Nytro) and I would line up and it was spin, spin, spin. The sleds were neck and neck after that, some me winning and some him winning. During our ride, we stopped to paly in the powder where both Shagman and myslef noticed the spring wrap on the secondary was too low and just sucked the belt down in the secondary. Was fun, but the deep snow was not as enjoyable with the belt slipping. Still, great fun and i got to see Shagman totally bury his sled on a hill....LMAO! When we arrived in Seney, I put on a new 8DN belt so I could break it in and try Saturday night and Sunday. The only great hook up I got was when Shagman dropped him arm and my XTX took off like a scared rabbit about 5 lengths in front of the Nytro. Tom (Mr Sled) took us on a road where I did back off and make a short run, I saw 106 but had a pucker moment when I saw everyone turning back onto the trail.

My setup now.... 8FP weights with a 3 gram rivot in the tip. G/W/G primary spring with a 3mm spacer, stock rollers. Secondary is Pink spring set at 6-1 with .080" washers under the helix which I kept the 45/39. 8DN belt
Rpm's were a max of 9,070

Shagman setup....8FP weights with a 3.7 rivot in the tip. 3mm spacer with a Y/G/Y spring, stock rollers. Secondary Pink spring set at 6-2 with washers under the 46/40 helix and 8DN belt.
Rpm's were a max of 9,150 where he said he was hitting the rev limiter.

Now, Sunday was a totally different situation as the warm weather and fresh grooming made trail 7 a slot car track. Skis in the air till 70 and hook like a mutha! Ran the smae setup but knocked it down to a wrap of 3-3 on the secondary. Better have 135 lbs. in that rear float as under power the skis are unless! Raced a few times and can say the Viper is back at it again with a maximum rpm of 8,940 - never hit the rev limiter and that oh so good freight train pull! Top speed on the trail was still just under 100 with the short runs I did and I know if there was a long enough path with hard crusted snow....107+ would be guaranteed. Talked to Allen Ulmer Friday and will be machining my clutches

The best part of this setup now is cruising speeds of 60 are at 6,700 rpm's which I am using a lot less fuel than the nytro. Back shift at 6-1 is very nice and it's a rocket from corner to corner with an awesome setup for 660 ft. snow drags. But, if you want top speed, the spring needs to be softened up as bottom end performance will give a little. My clutch mark is just a little better than it was last time, but I think the new belt....not the clutch setup helped with that. I think Allen is right with machining the primary to get better shift out.

All I can say people is give this a try if you want more power and better fuel economy. what a blast to ride.

 

[NOS-PRO]

That was the part that impressed me was the fuel economy we both were seeing compared to the other times I have gone riding. Plus, we were out all morning before the other 2.

Sled is in the shop and working on mounting the Wahl Brothers suspension along with the skis