Sidewinder Clutching experience

STAIN said:
but a bit more initial side pressure, correct? and will not bind
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They are very close. Stock yellow @ 60 is almost the same as the old B/O @70 beginning of the shift. At the end of the shift the stock yellow actually has slightly more overall force at these wraps.

No bind with the stock yellow @ 60
 
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STAIN said:
but a bit more initial side pressure, correct? and will not bind
Click to expand...

Yes, Dalton blk/org has slightly less torsion tension, but more side pressure. A must have, if running 8dn/8jp belt.

I've been running Ultimax XS825 belt, which has much better grip than the 8jp. Hence, additional side pressure not needed. I've had cooler clutches and better luck with stock yellow secondary spring IF using Ultimax belt. JMI....
 
Knapp’s figures on combined wrap and side pressure. If both springs were wrapped the same amount the Dalton B/O would more than likely shift out faster throughout the entire range. Stock yellow has more rate and would react like the B/O with an additional 20 degrees of wrap at full shift.
92770587-C0A9-4AFE-8609-F520F830E817.jpeg


Fleece,
I actually think the B/O at comparable wraps would tend to slip easier throughout the shift range with a 35 helix. Pre-tension and wrap tension combine themselves and basically achieve the same thing, side pressure. Difference being pre-tension always stays the same regardless of helix angle and wrap tension lessens as helix angle increases.
A good experiment would be to try them at the same wrap and see how they react.
 
ClutchMaster said:
Knapp’s figures on combined wrap and side pressure. If both springs were wrapped the same amount the Dalton B/O would more than likely shift out faster throughout the entire range. Stock yellow has more rate and would react like the B/O with an additional 20 degrees of wrap at full shift.
View attachment 156989

Fleece,
I actually think the B/O at comparable wraps would tend to slip easier throughout the shift range with a 35 helix. Pre-tension and wrap tension combine themselves and basically achieve the same thing, side pressure. Difference being pre-tension always stays the same regardless of helix angle and wrap tension lessens as helix angle increases.
A good experiment would be to try them at the same wrap and see how they react.
Click to expand...
Do you know if Mike ever tested the pink spring with his method? Last march I installed the pink spring at 6-1 after doing a wide open throttle run with stock yellow at 3-3. My sled was no top end monster as it had 1.75 track and the factory xtx se gearing of 24-50. It would pull hard and hit a wall at about 112 speedo and creep to 114 and stay there. I did multiple runs and never past 114. I stopped on side of trail and popped in my pink spring and started at 6-1 with it and gained a solid 4 mph on top. I did multiple pulls to confirm it was consistent and it was. Belt temp stayed cool at full throttle and seemed to run 10-15 degrees cooler in the trails according to my razorback.. I was expecting it to bind or see an increase in belt temps assuming it wouldnt be enough spring even for the xs belt. I didnt ride it enough before the season ended to get a good overall opinion on how the pink did in different conditions. I was planning on experimenting some more this winter and possibly trying a little more helix and sticking with the yellow, but Ive made some other changes that will require a little fine tuning first to establish a new baseline.
 
justinator said:
Do you know if Mike ever tested the pink spring with his method? Last march I installed the pink spring at 6-1 after doing a wide open throttle run with stock yellow at 3-3. My sled was no top end monster as it had 1.75 track and the factory xtx se gearing of 24-50. It would pull hard and hit a wall at about 112 speedo and creep to 114 and stay there. I did multiple runs and never past 114. I stopped on side of trail and popped in my pink spring and started at 6-1 with it and gained a solid 4 mph on top. I did multiple pulls to confirm it was consistent and it was. Belt temp stayed cool at full throttle and seemed to run 10-15 degrees cooler in the trails according to my razorback.. I was expecting it to bind or see an increase in belt temps assuming it wouldnt be enough spring even for the xs belt. I didnt ride it enough before the season ended to get a good overall opinion on how the pink did in different conditions. I was planning on experimenting some more this winter and possibly trying a little more helix and sticking with the yellow, but Ive made some other changes that will require a little fine tuning first to establish a new baseline.
Click to expand...
Wrap the pink at 6-2 and it pulls harder 115mph gps just doesn't seem as good as the b/o down low
 
sideshowBob said:
LOL...
I also use the Dalton Black/Orange spring in the secondary on my Winder;)!
Click to expand...
Have you tried the b/o spring with the Dalton black blue in the primary?wondering if that's a good combination
 
I have no data on the pink spring. It’s considerably softer than the yellow 4 sure. The only concern I would have if I were you would be getting into some loose snow conditions. The weaker spring would tend to overshift and the belt might slip..... but then again the XS belt is quite sticky when warm.
 
Yea I did a mail in
 
Yes for sure thats why I wanted to get some more seat time on it. I know the yellow at 3-3 works pretty good in a wide range of conditions with the 35 helix. It was good hard fast conditions when I tried the pink spring. I cant make an honest statement about it in looser or heavy snow conditions. something in between might be a good option .
 
ClutchMaster said:
I have no data on the pink spring. It’s considerably softer than the yellow 4 sure. The only concern I would have if I were you would be getting into some loose snow conditions. The weaker spring would tend to overshift and the belt might slip..... but then again the XS belt is quite sticky when warm.
Click to expand...
What about the Dalton black blue primary set with a b/ o secondary
 
Fast said:
What about the Dalton black blue primary set with a b/ o secondary
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Guess you’ll just have to actually try it.
 
Fast said:
Have you tried the b/o spring with the Dalton black blue in the primary?wondering if that's a good combination
Click to expand...
I tried that combo early on, but I had Heavy Hitters in there and it always felt like the primary was binding so when I went to the Cat torsional springs Red/White then Dalton Cat (White then Black/Lime) it was night and day better.
 
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