Stronger belt

[Beerman]

Nope, that's not the problem. My drive train and clutches are meticulously maintained, adjusted, and lined up using the official Team alignment bar and plug. To my knowledge, no one is using Cat belts (made in China) on their Cat. After I switched to XS have not a single failure.
BTW, I also have an infrared belt temp gage so I can watch belt temps. It was not heat that destroyed the Cat belts as many failed at very cool temps (like 75 -90 degF). One last point, I always break belts in for about 30 miles of easy riding.

@Turboflash what infrared temp gauge are you running?

 

[Turboflash]

Razorback Technology 3.0. Mounted above my cluster. Has a quick disconnect same place as the hood connector so you can disconnect and remove hood as normal. It stores max temp and average temp but resets each time you cycle the key. Very fast acting. I have IR beam aimed at the middle of my belt in the secondary clutch. It has 14:1 focal ratio which means at 14" away from sensor it's only seeing a 1" circle. This tight focal ration is nice since as the belt shifts it is moving away from sensor and also you don't want it to be picking up temp from something other than belt (secondary clutch sheaves). You get choice of colors and bezels. The very best feature is that it has a programmable color LED on gage with 3 colors. When you order it, you tell them what temps to set the colors at. For example, I have mine set for green (for go!) up to 170 degF. Then the light turns orange until 200 at which time it turns red. After 210 it starts to flash red. It's nice to be able to see what color you have out of your peripheral vision. It's hard and dangerous to be looking down trying to read a temp at 120+ MPH. I know there's cheaper ones out there but this one tough and can take very low temps (last year I rode at -38 degF and it still working fine!) and has never glitched out. See pics.
https://www.razorbackusa.com/product-page/3-0-edition-infrared-belt-temp-gauge

 

[PowderFalcon]

Man, that is very slick!!! have you seen it go red then POW blown belt?!?!

 

[Turboflash]

Man, that is very slick!!! have you seen it go red then POW blown belt?!?!

To be honest, for normal "high-speed" aggressive trail riding, belt temps usually are warm but not hot. I see 120-150 running hard. It's the back-to-back WOT that heats the belt up, like doing multiple long WOT on a lake. I've only shredded 1 belt due to high temps and that was ditch banging in really deep snow where you had to keep the track speed way up and not much air coming through the front end. Most of the time I've blown a belt, they have been in the "normal" heat range like 125 or so. The conclusion I've drawn is that at some point the little rubber and glue molecules in the belt get tired of holding hands (just due to load from a 300HP engine and lots of long studs) and the belt comes apart. Earlier in this string I stated my opinion that the XS belt holds up the best to these tuned 998s. I've talked to belt engineers and told me that starting at about 225 the belt will start to weaken and come apart. If one is seeing belt temps over 150 allot IMO you better take a hard look at your clutching because the belt must be slipping to be getting that hot. The IR belt temp gage is very nice for keeping an eye out and knowing when to back off to let it cool for a bit.

 

[STAIN]

How did you come up with those temps? I have never seen a graph comparing belt temps to belt delam.

 

[Turboflash]

I talked to application engineers at Dayco and Gates separately. Both told me 225 degF is pretty much the end for today's belts. They said that is the temp when the bonding agents are affected to the point where they break down and the belt starts to come apart.
My chosen temps for my IR gage color changes are just temps I've chosen based on what the engineers told me. I felt below 170 was very acceptable. Over 170 should be a zone where one wants to know the belt is heating up. At 200 (which you should never see!) it's back off time. The belt I overheated in the multi-mile ditch last year came apart at 225. It actually got to about 235 degF but was already coming apart by then.
As I said, temp is only 1 component of belt failure. Most of the belts I've blown were only "warm" not hot. Tells me the load exceeded the strength of the belt.

 

[STAIN]

interesting....

 

[Turboflash]

Ask any belt manufacturer and (if they're honest) they'll tell you there is no belt that is designed for the HP today's tuned 998s are making. The best you can hope for is reasonable life (whatever that is?) based on your riding style. If you run WOT allot (w lots of long studs), your belt life will be shorter. I run my belts about 1000 miles max and then put a new one on. I just figure by then, I've subjected the belt fibers to plenty of stress and so as to not push my "luck" I will just not chance it and put a new one on before it blows up.

 

[cannondale27]

Why are we confusing things even more now with clutching between the arctic cat clutching and the sidewinder clutching,the last time I checked this is a Yamaha site and I feel things should be talked only about Yamaha clutches,if you guys with the cats want to talk belts and clutches start a thread about them only on that thread. jm2cents

I am guilty of this also but Snowbeast is right. Cat clutches should be discussed in a separate thread.

 

[Turboflash]

Ok, I thought the thread was about "Stronger Belt?" My last posts were about clutch alignment, belt experiences, talking with belt engineers and IR belt temp gages. All of these are relative to 998s in general? Or, am I wrong?

 

[stevewithOCD]

No you're not wrong.
I just learned a ton.
I think i "need" that IR gauge also. DAMN YOU!

 

[74Nitro]

Good insight here TF
This can be applied to all brands and of course we'll include Yamaha in that.

 

[fourload]

Very slick gauge and great insight on belt heat. Haven’t blown a belt yet on my stock winder in 1500 miles. Will be running Powertrail and MS 16 SM this year so I switched to the XS 825 belt. Hope I have good luck with this belt like I did with the JP.

 

[Fleecer]

No you're not wrong.
I just learned a ton.
I think i "need" that IR gauge also. DAMN YOU!

Yup...some great info there. Thanks for sharing!!

I love the analogy of the rubber and glue molecules getting tired of holding hands. Apparently the rubber and glue molecules in my last 8JP were in a domestic dispute and got divorced!

 

[Turboflash]

From testing for at least 2 years now, XS belt holds up the best for my sled. I have tried Cat, Gates (carbon fiber 49C****), Timken (XS), and Dayco (XTX). Your results might be different.