Excessive primary clutch rattle

[jaydaniels]

whats interesting here...is the same motor in the cats...and no complaints over there...Im wondering if its the crank output/stub shaft or the clutch after all..

also...theres significant side play between the weights and weight spacers AND between the weight and the roller face....SO im wondering if a larger roller (either a 15 or 15.5) (and yes I understand the less force of the larger roller) and or spider shim can make some weights make contact with the roller at idle (were the stockers dont) and therefore not rattle as much...with the negative being less ramp up run in the nuetral position?

Im also curious if my apex clutch is quieter..( I believe so ) and will be trying it when my sled returns



and for dan and mike...is the pb80 the same sheave angle?

I have a friend with a thundercat. He mentioned that his rattles. I haven't heard it myself so not sure if it's as loud as the Yamaha but it does rattle to some extent.

 

[STAIN]

That clutch looks beyond simple. Never tried one. Interesting.
I would try one if they worked better, grabbed the belt harder, maybe if they grabbed the belt tighter on bottom. I wouldn't try one to just get rid of a rattle.

 

[GYTR GEARHEAD]

That clutch looks beyond simple. Never tried one. Interesting.
I would try one if they worked better, grabbed the belt harder, maybe if they grabbed the belt tighter on bottom. I wouldn't try one to just get rid of a rattle.

buddy bought one for is 1200 and man they are smooth they grab hard at low rpm no belt slip at all ease of tunning i am sold

 

[Pstn head]

The Yamaha clutches have been virtually bullet proof, excellant belt life, and very little maintainance and have rattled for years. The rattle is not translated from parts smashing each other to premature wear (like the Doo 1200) They work great and hold high horsepower, I know of some extremely high horsepower sleds running the clutch with no issues.

 

[aVenture]

Back in 2005 with the first 3 holer, the start of the rattle on this clutch.
Washers, leather pieces, 0-rings, nylon this or that to fill gaps on rollers, screws, pins...etc. I have tried it all until Yam shim kit for the slider shoes came up but lasted only for a short time.
We realized the shim kit is too gross and not tightening equally right. End result must also be so tight that you barely move by hand. In the end, maybe only one side of one of the 3 branch is too much but will wear almost instantly. Don't be afraid, there is a lot of force in the system and it will move no matter what.
A good shim job will last a 4000 miles season and must be done with several thickness materials:
-pepsi, bud & mexican beer cans are good different thickness material, but you have to drink it first..

Theses early engine also had a snubber between taper and crank, and i know the material was replaced since. But for me, building a tool to separate the clutch and do the job each season and in-between if need be was the thing. 40k noiseless miles.

Pic is my tool and one branch stuffed up. Those sliders last forever but you have to back 'em up. New one are useless, they use fast because its surface do not fit exactly the round cast shape.... once used a little, it surface contact is perfect. By that time, maybe it rattle already. So that means, so not play around with these and keep 'em at the same place.

The tool is only a 1/2" socket that fit the clutch shaft with 3 branch i welded. I use a 3 feet pipe to drive the wrench.... ClockWise please, its reversed threading. Pins on the holder must be hard steal.... bolts do good since it prevent slippage. Still preheat inside of clutch to crack the red locktite.

 

[snowbeast]

Easy way to figure this all out...in another thread a member ran the pb80 on his nytro, now this may have been awhile back so not sure if he would remember. But search up pb80 nytro section. He sure seemed to like it. I wonder if his was quiet?

So me not knowing the history of Nytro/Viper....are you guys all saying those rattled the same and its NOT clutch, but the stub shaft? I dont ever recall any of this from buds how owned them yrs ago.

As for pb80....well, those things are so darn simple, no arms, no weights, no rollers, literally no moving parts...just a big plastic BLOCK that slides within the angled cap....its so simple its hard to believe they even work.LOL

I just keep thinking, for abit more then the price of a clutch kit, you can buy entire pb80 and likely have quietest clutch made and one that lasts many many thousands of miles without even worry of rebuild. Nothing to really wear out.

Pete there are only two tools needed, a LARGE 1-7/16 socket to remove the large NUT, and then a HOLDER tool which is cheap too. Many guys with stock 1200s run these clutches, I loved mine. And many with stage 1 around 240hp use them too, but not alot that I know of over 250hp...so not sure the limitations on them. Wowchad is a member on DT and here, and he tells me they have a 2 stage spring setup being worked on for the SW turbo. But there currently is a pb80 out now for nytro/viper which should physically fit....just likely would need a heavier set of weights.

Few pics of my 1200 pb80....

Thanks Dan,your illustration is always spot on bro,love all your pics,for guys like me,that need them,lol yes,i may be interested to find out if it will improve performance of the 270hp package I now have,maybe it will develop less belt dust vrs stock primary,i just cant believe how dusty my side panel is,plus all the dust all over my K&N filter from my CAI system now has. Is the engagement and full shift rpms easy to establish and hold during shift? I would like 3200-3400 engagement and final shift 9300 and hold.

 

[snowbeast]

See how dusty my filter and side of sled is from stock clutches and 8JP belt

 

[Sledroll]

Hey Dan,

My bud did the same thing but after about two rides it was loud again. I love the sled for what it provides but this is not Yamaha quality at all and we cannot blame cat on this one(they are easy to blame for QC issues right). Mine sounds like a diesel truck even after I added some shims to the pins etc. definitely better but still loud. There has to be a way to put a rubber dampener in between the stub shaft and mating area to take this rattle out. I had friends ride the sled and were amazed by it but they all commented on the clutch noises and that is bad for the image of Yamaha and their QC. Sure it doesn't hurt the longevity or performance but that is a Cat way of doing things not what we expect from Yamaha right!

Jester

This is a perfect example of , if Yamaha had a person monitoring these threads they could respond corporately , to eliminate the questions posed about what is causing the noise .
If anyone knows , they do , and that info would go a long way to help find a cure , and if it is even possible .

 

[Motorhead]

This is a perfect example of , if Yamaha had a person monitoring these threads they could respond corporately , to eliminate the questions posed about what is causing the noise .
If anyone knows , they do , and that info would go a long way to help find a cure , and if it is even possible .

I called and spoke with Yamaha Relations. They claimed that they have not heard of such a problem and that I was the only one they have heard from. In fact unless they get more calls for documentation of the loud clutch problem, nothing will come of it. Mine is documented in case of future problems it should help I was told.

 

[KnappAttack]

Mike,did you already buy a 2017 SW? I know you have been watching with wide eyes,sense you are one who loves boost too,but I thought you were checking out the 18,s?

Red 17 LTX-LE sitting in my shop Pete. Also I already have the Hurricane/Hindle muffler and all the bundle of tunes, bluetooth tune installer and clutch weights from Hurricane as well.

Hi Mike,i did a little searching on the pb80,very simple looking clutch,but how would we hold that clutch from going CW when we want to install it,with a torque wrench,do PB provide a strap wrench to install and remove the clutch for a price? Cheapest price I could find was on E-Bay $470.00 us funds.

Powerblock offers a clutch holder/wrench to Tq. the nut and bolt down without the crank movine, but don't expect the PB80 to do well at drag racing at all. Its a great trail clutch and works well, but with good traction it cant grab the belt down low like a flyweight clutch can. Nothing can be done to help with the belt grip either with the fixed cover acting as the ramp curvature. I know it will hold 270-280 HP, but don't expect it to 60 foot good on the ice like a Yamaha clutch could. One thing is certain though, it will make for a quiet clutch.

 

[GYTR GEARHEAD]

the noise is a byproduct from the stub shaft assembly with no load on yamaha have this unique design witch produce this signature rattle its not a problem it's just how it is until they come up with a totally different design the rattle is here to stay ..... for 500$ you can get the rattle to almost get away .... nothing any good trail can wont take care of lol

 

[KnappAttack]

Even under load while riding mine rattles all the way up to about 5000 RPM or thereabouts. Its a worse rattle than I've ever had on a TRA equipped 1200 Doo that is certain.

I'm hoping it gets better with more power and much heavier clutch weight. I know adding weight to the TRA cured that rattle when we added turbos and upped the power. Not sure the Yamaha clutch will quiet or not until I try it, but my buds does not rattle with extra weigh in it, he however has a loud EVO magnum muffler on it and maybe I just cant hear it over that noise maker. I don't recall any rattle when I rode his.

 

[snowbeast]

Red 17 LTX-LE sitting in my shop Pete. Also I already have the Hurricane/Hindle muffler and all the bundle of tunes, bluetooth tune installer and clutch weights from Hurricane as well.

Powerblock offers a clutch holder/wrench to Tq. the nut and bolt down without the crank movine, but don't expect the PB80 to do well at drag racing at all. Its a great trail clutch and works well, but with good traction it cant grab the belt down low like a flyweight clutch can. Nothing can be done to help with the belt grip either with the fixed cover acting as the ramp curvature. I know it will hold 270-280 HP, but don't expect it to 60 foot good on the ice like a Yamaha clutch could. One thing is certain though, it will make for a quiet clutch.

Sweet,have you been racking up any miles yet,or did you just get it mike? Thanks for the pb80 I was more interested in belt grip and engagement and overall rpms holding,but sounds like I may be better off with what I have. Mine does rattle some at idle but once going cant hear it,or its not there.

 

[snowbeast]

the noise is a byproduct from the stub shaft assembly with no load on yamaha have this unique design witch produce this signature rattle its not a problem it's just how it is until they come up with a totally different design the rattle is here to stay ..... for 500$ you can get the rattle to almost get away .... nothing any good trail can wont take care of lol

Hi,so what does $500 get ya.

 

[GYTR GEARHEAD]

Hi,so what does $500 get ya.

pb80 wich almost get the rattle away