Interesting rumor

[low slung]

Actually no apex model at all. A different sled all together

A yamaha race team official stated last winter that the nytro motor could easily touch 150+hp with a few enhancements(some were running these enchancements last winter,got this info of a oval racing forum).Would make sense to release a more powerful version of the existing nytro mill in an all new package.But where would the apex fit in this picture?The apex beening axed has more truth then that rumor of the yamaha tech supplied cat sled(one of the comments on supertraxs eased my mind of this )

 

[OVR4D]

We jumped ship to Ski-Doo this year. Really hoping Yamaha comes out with something new for 2014. We had a Vector and Nytro and did not want to replace them with pretty much the same sleds we already had. A front dump exhaust version of the Nytro engine in Cats chassis would be sweet. I would buy one for 2015/2016. I will be running my new 800R E-Tec for three winters. Same with my wifes new 600. It is kinda weird though. We had great service at Kens Yamaha in Norway Maine. Kinda feel like a trader leaving them....

No need to feel that way. You're decision to switch brands in order to get a product you want is exactly whats needed to bring about change. It's a shinning example of the way a market economy is supposed to work. Enjoy your new sleds with no regrets ... and don't leave this forum. I'm sure we'd all love to hear what you think of the new Doo's, especially given your experience with the Vector and Nytro.

 

[vector06]

I am still on here every day. Do not post much but I am always around...

 

[AKrider]

my 2009 Phazer GT weighs the same as my 1985 Phazer. The only reason for me buying my 2009 versus any other model. The 85' Phazer is rated 53 hp i think. The 09' is 80 hp that's close to 30 hp more. Now my old Phazer was a hand full. The 09' is a riot to drive. Plus it's light enough to "throw around". All my friends I ride with have Nitro's Apex's and Cat 700 and Ski-Don't 600's . They dont laugh or even ask me to race. I have pulled everyone of them out of the hole untill I reach about 50 mph. on the trail they cant hold a candle to me. The Ski-Don't 600 is the only one that will give me a run for my money in the trail but he is ridding is butt of to keep up. I average about 16mpg. I followed a kid on a Cat 550? and he couldn't shake me for his life. I have grown up on Phazers and love them. It cracks me up when people say they are heavy and are slow. compaired to the old ones they are a rocket ship. If you are a BIG guy and dont want to give the sled riders in put (just sit and ride) the Phazer is NOT for you. My big friends don't like it cause it's small and nimble. If you like to ride dirt bikes and are a active rider the Phazer will be a fun sled for you. In our group everybody gets close to the same mpg. And on open road yea it's not quick but for me and how and where we ride it's perfect. Thanks, for the rant...

Sorry Tucker, don't mean to offend but the '85 Phazer is much, much lighter than the new 4-stroke Phazer. I had an '85 Phazer a few years ago that I fixed up and got running and it was like a toy. It was very light to pick up and throw around. I recall the dry weight was around 390 lbs. The fan cooled Phazers got a little heavier when they became the Phazer II. The current Phazer is much heavier than the old fan cooled versions since its a 4-stroke, liquid cooled, mechanical reverse, e-start & battery, fuel injection, lots more suspension and physically larger. As I recall, the only modern 500cc 2-stroke sled it was lighter than was the Cat F5 equipped with electric start and the weights were compared fully fueled, ready to ride and the Cat had a much larger gas tank. I remember seeing a magazine article or a Yamaha ad where they had both the Phazer and F5 hanging from a scale and the Phazer was lighter. The F-series Cats were known for being the heaviest 2-stroke chassis and now that all has changed while the Phazer has not.

Back to the original topic, it sounds like Yamaha might have something new coming out for '14 and I'll be watching but I won't buy the first year version. Their new sled will have to be lighter for me to consider it because while amazing engine reliabilty is awesome, have that great engine wrapped in a heavy chassis that doesn't perform takes the fun out of riding for me.

 

[cannondale27]

I would find it hard to believe that if the engine was removed from a Nytro or a Phazer that the chassis isnt lighter in the Yamahas compared to almost any chassis out there.Why compare a 4stroke to a 2 stroke at all?A nytro should be compared to a F1100 or maybe a Doo 1200 and a Phazer should be compared to a Ace 600.I dont believe Polaris even makes ANYTHING that is even in the same class spec wise as the Nytro or Phazer.I believe Yamaha looks at things long term and yes in racing as long as 2 strokes are out there that are not even available to the general public or are so unreliable that any sane person would not want them It seems as though Yamaha will not be in competition.So What!Its not the real world for 99% of us who cant afford a 2 stroke 3000mile motor life if lucky.2 strokes are dead or dying.I dont like it but it is the way it is.4 strokes are the future.If they would race the Production 4 strokes as premier class rather than some make believe brand competition that really should mean nothing to the consumer.I have no doubt Yamaha would just dominate the competition....Until they decide to put Yamaha motors in their chassis!

 

[Sasquatch]

Actually no apex model at all. A different sled all together

A yamaha race team official stated last winter that the nytro motor could easily touch 150+hp with a few enhancements(some were running these enchancements last winter,got this info of a oval racing forum).Would make sense to release a more powerful version of the existing nytro mill in an all new package.But where would the apex fit in this picture?The apex beening axed has more truth then that rumor of the yamaha tech supplied cat sled(one of the comments on supertraxs eased my mind of this )

The Apex could easily touch 170hp with a few enhancements! The Apex is the flagship. Does Yami really want to get rid of thier flagship model to replace it with a 3 banger making no more hp? Apex is the best groomed trail rider out there the Nytro is not.

To the turbo crowd who want a 3 banger and turbo option. The 3 banger is barely lighter then the 4 and with a turbo installed it would be as heavier. Can't see the point.

I'm sceptical!

 

[LJ 452]

If they would race the Production 4 strokes as premier class rather than some make believe brand competition that really should mean nothing to the consumer.I have no doubt Yamaha would just dominate the competition....Until they decide to put Yamaha motors in their chassis!

Well, since the other manufactures (except Poo) have a comparable 4 stroke. I would think that it wouldn't be quite that easy for Yamaha. They struggled to get the SX sled to handle, and compete, it's not a weight issue, the sled was probable within 20 lbs of the others. It was setup and handling that they couldn't dial. The competition has the chassis/suspension down. No doubt they would have to get their motors wound a bit, but any consumer motor can be wound for 20 laps.

I do support a full 4 stroke SX class, I think it would only provide better sleds for the consumer.

 

[sheetwright]

I believe people want an option similar to cat with a naturally aspirated four stroke at 140+, and a boosted version at 180+ HP. That way they can pick. Stream lining the motors instead of making multiple engines saves on production costs. I just hope whatever they do that the boosted option is flex able for big power like the cat. Add a hyjacker and get 200+ HP. Now that's cool

 

[Super Sled]

I believe people want an option similar to cat with a naturally aspirated four stroke at 140+, and a boosted version at 180+ HP. That way they can pick. Stream lining the motors instead of making multiple engines saves on production costs. I just hope whatever they do that the boosted option is flex able for big power like the cat. Add a hyjacker and get 200+ HP. Now that's cool

I think you're right to a "T" about yamaha's plans, and 2014 is the magic year. But I will always, always miss the apex engine and chassis personally.

 

[AKrider]

The reason to compare a Yamaha to a 2-stroke is because there is no choice. Yamaha doesn't offer anything else. The other OEM's have not embraced 4-strokes the way Yamaha has but they at least offer a choice with both 2 & 4-strokes. Pick your poison - light weight, agility, good ride and handling plus quick revving power go 2-stroke. Want dependability and a long lasting engine go 4-stroke.

Last season I recall reading the rules for the Soo and they allow for the Doo 1200 to compete. USCC allows for the 1100 Cat to compete but it doesn't look like either of those OEM's are very interested in promoting their 4-strokes. Don't know why that is the case?

I hope Yamaha is bringing out something new and improved for '14. Kinda sucked to eat crow with my buddies to go back to a 2-stroke BUT, they just perform and work so dang well that it made the choice pretty easy. An Arctic Cat Pro-cross with a Nytro motor would potentially be a promising sled.

 

[low slung]

Interesting read from a motorcycle site.Guess yamahas sled motors get really noticed.More interesting is a rumour that the future R1 and R6 maybe triple designs?Is there a future for our beloved quad in the apex ?:exc: http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2012/10/ ... nd-future/

 

[Sasquatch]

I believe people want an option similar to cat with a naturally aspirated four stroke at 140+, and a boosted version at 180+ HP. That way they can pick. Stream lining the motors instead of making multiple engines saves on production costs. I just hope whatever they do that the boosted option is flex able for big power like the cat. Add a hyjacker and get 200+ HP. Now that's cool

I believe people want more power! They always do! Yami has three motors! Cat has at least 6 Doo has 4 or 5. Seems Yami is already stream lined.

Yami turbo! Well Yami faithful have wished for that since 2003 and they did finally add boost for the high altitude crowd. Boost for the lowlanders is a dream! Odds are slim to none its going to happen. But I guess all can wish!

Myself I'm hoping they leave the Apex motor alone. It is the best 4 stroke of them all bar none. Its the reason many bought a Yami. Its the reason many want a Yami. Get rid of it and Yami just becomes another triple. Great superbike sound is gone. Chills up the spine is gone. Just ho hum after that.

Why would anyone want to turn the Apex into a three cylinder is beyond me. It just seems like a step backwards. I see no benifit!

 

[Duey782]

Why would anyone want to turn the Apex into a three cylinder is beyond me. It just seems like a step backwards. I see no benifit!

They could do this and call it a Hector.. or Lector, or something along those lines.

 

[jaydaniels]

I believe people want an option similar to cat with a naturally aspirated four stroke at 140+, and a boosted version at 180+ HP. That way they can pick. Stream lining the motors instead of making multiple engines saves on production costs. I just hope whatever they do that the boosted option is flex able for big power like the cat. Add a hyjacker and get 200+ HP. Now that's cool

I believe people want more power! They always do! Yami has three motors! Cat has at least 6 Doo has 4 or 5. Seems Yami is already stream lined.

Yami turbo! Well Yami faithful have wished for that since 2003 and they did finally add boost for the high altitude crowd. Boost for the lowlanders is a dream! Odds are slim to none its going to happen. But I guess all can wish!

Myself I'm hoping they leave the Apex motor alone. It is the best 4 stroke of them all bar none. Its the reason many bought a Yami. Its the reason many want a Yami. Get rid of it and Yami just becomes another triple. Great superbike sound is gone. Chills up the spine is gone. Just ho hum after that.

Why would anyone want to turn the Apex into a three cylinder is beyond me. It just seems like a step backwards. I see no benifit!

Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't the boost an aftermarket add-on, not a factory item? If so, they are now offering a similar kit for the 'lowlanders'. Its nice that its offered but another 4500.00 or so added to the already hight prices is out of reach for most people.

 

[NFLD-Nytro]

I would find it hard to believe that if the engine was removed from a Nytro or a Phazer that the chassis isnt lighter in the Yamahas compared to almost any chassis out there.Why compare a 4stroke to a 2 stroke at all?A nytro should be compared to a F1100 or maybe a Doo 1200 and a Phazer should be compared to a Ace 600.I dont believe Polaris even makes ANYTHING that is even in the same class spec wise as the Nytro or Phazer.I believe Yamaha looks at things long term and yes in racing as long as 2 strokes are out there that are not even available to the general public or are so unreliable that any sane person would not want them It seems as though Yamaha will not be in competition.So What!Its not the real world for 99% of us who cant afford a 2 stroke 3000mile motor life if lucky.2 strokes are dead or dying.I dont like it but it is the way it is.4 strokes are the future.If they would race the Production 4 strokes as premier class rather than some make believe brand competition that really should mean nothing to the consumer.I have no doubt Yamaha would just dominate the competition....Until they decide to put Yamaha motors in their chassis!

Why compare a 2 stroke to 4? Because if you're shopping for a sled you have the choice between one or the other, so of course you have to compare them.

2-strokes are far from dead, though I can see that for trail riders they aren't as attractive as a modern 4 stroke.