Have you guys heard this news about Arctic Cat?

[SumpBuster]

Well, I was a Never Catter, and would never have bought one. I was wrong. The procross is a great chassis. With the 998 under the hood, well, nothing stock compares, overall. Quality issues, yeah, but they are getting there. With the joint venture, we have to be interested in what Arctic Cat has and does. Still feels a little weird though....lol!

 

[whitedust1]

Imo no indication that the Textron OEM agreement will continue for Yamaha 2021 line up. AC is all 2s in performance class sleds except the Tcat so what does Yamaha have to offer in a procross a blue Tcat and a 4s Viper? That dog don’t hunt anymore low market numbers for ROI. If that’s all Yamaha has to offer it’s basically over. The discussions regarding delta box and pure Yamaha sleds will become a dim memory and the only reason to buy Yamaha would be for a 4s Viper until AC drops in there own Textron 4s engine. If Yamaha had a pure Yamaha sled they would have given us some insight by now. As time has evolved it seems to me the intelligent purchase would be the Tcat since it is an AC design and admit AC won the war and Yamaha is done just no profit to continue with duplicate branded Sidewinder sleds.

 

[TPAY243]

You want to explain what motor that textron has that will compete with either the 1049 or 998 triples that Yamaha has. They are now using Yamaha motors in there sxs. Textron can not build a competitive 4 stroke, it is much easier to out source it to YAMAHA. You just need to except the facts and ride off into the sunset with your drive by wire 900T Ski Don't.

 

[20/80]

I would say Textron would have the tech and money to build a competitive engine or pretty darn close, they have not been convinced that the sled side of Cat is worth a big investment, I would say Cat's sled side of the business is on notice from Textron, its all about money and profit, if Cat cannot produce numbers its over, although Cat was a legend in the snowmobile business over the years they struggled financially, Textron will only go so far before the axe, you closet Cat guy's are saving Cat not Yamaha.

 

[whitedust1]

You want to explain what motor that textron has that will compete with either the 1049 or 998 triples that Yamaha has. They are now using Yamaha motors in there sxs. Textron can not build a competitive 4 stroke, it is much easier to out source it to YAMAHA. You just need to except the facts and ride off into the sunset with your drive by wire 900T Ski Don't.

Your opinion is that a Yamaha Viper order from Yamaha will satisfy Textron production profitability that’s fine we with me. My opinion the numbers don’t add up to be worth it to either company for the snow division. Textron could easily replace the Viper 4s engine the turbo probably not they will stay with Yamaha that’s why the Tcat is the better purchase for support in the coming years. I totally accept the facts that Yamaha is done producing any sled with anything but the procross chassis. My opinion is that Textron could care less continuing any agreement with Yamaha to cross brand the procross. The agreement was inherited and not necessary for Textron to continue with snow products. It’s obvious the procross is here to stay for the near future so parts will be available thru AC dealers for many years. Imo a buyer would be more secure buying a Tcat vs a Sidewinder. The only reason to purchase a SW is Yamaha dealer preference but how long will Yamaha dealers be satisfied with a 2 product performance product line? Obviously Port saw the writing on the wall and picked up the AC product line a couple of years ago. I would luv to see a pure Yamaha sled product line return to the market place but the facts don’t indicate that is or will happen for 2021.

 

[TPAY243]

Your trying to change the subject what about these motors they will be useing are they going to discontinue the dirt devision also. Textron can't build a competitive motor if you ever drove or rode in any of there Atv/Utv/Sxs you would know. Textron could very well drop or sell the Attic Cat devision but it surly will not be because of Yamaha motors. I do realize that Artic Cat builds their own motors for there snowmobiles and dirt products but I think that they are a little down on power and tech. compared to their competition. Why do you think they have used Suzuki and now Yamaha powerplants. I honestly think that was the start of the whole Artic Cat problem is when they started to build there own poweplants. It cost money to R&D all of this stuff when they could have out source it.

 

[whitedust1]

Your trying to change the subject what about these motors they will be useing are they going to discontinue the dirt devision also. Textron can't build a competitive motor if you ever drove or rode in any of there Atv/Utv/Sxs you would know. Textron could very well drop or sell the Attic Cat devision but it surly will not be because of Yamaha motors. I do realize that Artic Cat builds their own motors for there snowmobiles and dirt products but I think that they are a little down on power and tec. compared to their competition. Why do you think they have used Suzuki and now Yamaha powerplants. I honestly think that was the start of the whole Artic Cat problem is when they started to build there own poweplants. It cost money to R&D all of this stuff when they could have out source it.

The only reason Textron or any company outsources to an Oem is due to costs internally vs externally. That cost comparison is a constant struggle with R&D costs to keep engines or any product in or out of house. Textron could easily replace the NA Viper engine if they choose to do so the turbo probably not. That’s just life within Textron business as usual. Dirt products is what Textron is all about snow products has limited value to Textron but they recently invested in the future with their procross and alpha production. AC showed little interest in 4s sleds probably because the consumer wants 2s sleds. Imo Textron is indifferent to Yamaha 4s sleds they just don’t care and why they went 2s on everything but the Tcat.

 

[TPAY243]

I disagree Cat sells more Thunder Cat/9000 then any others there 600 and 800 are down in power compared to the competition. I personally think the Suzuki power plants were more on par with the rest. There 800 is a great sled but it is not a 850 and that's what everybody wants. That's why Cat will never get rid of the Thunder, only one machine that might be better, aka the Winder. So you can think 2 stroke all you want but with Cat and Textrons in house motors I think there dicking a dead dog. There is now way textron can build a better motor than the 1050 or 998 unless it is out source by someone like Suzuki,Kawi,or even Honda that's just the way it is and you can take that to the bank.

 

[ClutchMaster]

Here’s the good news!!!!

 

[cannondale27]

Here’s the good news!!!!
View attachment 150875

Yea you guys are really getting it! I just hope it doesnt end up like last year where there was too much snow on the lakes for the roads to be plowed. We here arent even close to having our trails in. Lot of crop on yet and mud everywhere.

 

[ClutchMaster]

Yea you guys are really getting it! I just hope it doesnt end up like last year where there was too much snow on the lakes for the roads to be plowed. We here arent even close to having our trails in. Lot of crop on yet and mud everywhere.

CDale any time you wanna get up here in big snow country you let me know. I got two hots and a cot for ya
Let it snow!

P.S. we could talk shocks over breakfast!

 

[whitedust1]

I disagree Cat sells more Thunder Cat/9000 then any others there 600 and 800 are down in power compared to the competition. I personally think the Suzuki power plants were more on par with the rest. There 800 is a great sled but it is not a 850 and that's what everybody wants. That's why Cat will never get rid of the Thunder, only one machine that might be better, aka the Winder. So you can think 2 stroke all you want but with Cat and Textrons in house motors I think there dicking a dead dog. There is now way textron can build a better motor than the 1050 or 998 unless it is out source by someone like Suzuki,Kawi,or even Honda that's just the way it is and you can take that to the bank.

I hope this is not directed to me I never said AC sells more Tcats than the rest of their 2s sled product line. I agree AC couldn’t and would not attempt to build a NA Viper or Turbo 4s engine no resources to do so but Textron could and would at least the NA Viper engine. Textron may have a grandfather OEM agreement with Yamaha to use their turbo engine which justified the Yamaha development costs over X period of time. Imo the Tcat turbo is here to stay and so is the procross in the near future. The question is what happens to the Yamaha Viper and Sidewinder? Probably more of the same on the 4s sled side of AC production but only if Textron chooses to do so. Neither Textron or Yamaha has said anything regarding Yamaha 2021 mutual products. That’s the elephant in the room for now and the big question for Yamaha.

 

[TPAY243]

Ya it is directed at you nobody else on here says the stuff you say Textron is Artic Cat and no, textron could not and will not build a hi performance 4st with out contracting it out. Please explain why you think Yamaha won't be with Cat in 2021 you say all this carp and nothing to back it up. Please explain why Yamaha and Cat will not be working together in 2021 or beyond just cause Cat has shown there cards for 2021 and Yamaha hasn't, that don't mean carp guy. Textron will build snowmachines for YAMAHA for a long time to come if it is just the Viper and the Winder who cares. I personally think the Viper is a great sled and would definitely by a new one before I bought into the Ski Don't kool aid with there not so hi performance drive by wire 900 T.

 

[SumpBuster]

Yea you guys are really getting it! I just hope it doesnt end up like last year where there was too much snow on the lakes for the roads to be plowed. We here arent even close to having our trails in. Lot of crop on yet and mud everywhere.

We (NY upstate) may be getting a noreaster Sun-Mon, then cold. Already had 6 inches, but melted behind me like those Langoliers eating time! Fortunately, I do NOT have a lame 850, so the sidewinder stayed ahead of it...lol!

 

[20/80]

Ya it is directed at you nobody else on here says the stuff you say Textron is Artic Cat and no, textron could not and will not build a hi performance 4st with out contracting it out. Please explain why you think Yamaha won't be with Cat in 2021 you say all this carp and nothing to back it up. Please explain why Yamaha and Cat will not be working together in 2021 or beyond just cause Cat has shown there cards for 2021 and Yamaha hasn't, that don't mean carp guy. Textron will build snowmachines for YAMAHA for a long time to come if it is just the Viper and the Winder who cares. I personally think the Viper is a great sled and would definitely by a new one before I bought into the Ski Don't kool aid with there not so hi performance drive by wire 900 T.

You seem to be a book of knowledge but have not backed up any off your claims, but are so quick to jump on somebody else's opinion, you think Yamaha as ever sourced a engine for their powersport products? actually just a few years ago they sourced Subaru to build a engine for their 700 Grizzlies 16 through to 18 year models the 708, and i'm sure Weber engines owned by Textron could build a 4stroke for their procross equal or darn close to the viper engine and maybe even the 998t.