NEW MODEL IN FEB 2010?

[Jeremy]

Re: Lots of speculation...

I'm reading a lot of speculating going on here --- everything from using a newer version of the R-1 engine to using the new supercharged water craft engine. One thing that I haven't seen anyone mention is the 200 hp liquid- cooled four-stroke DOHC 65 degree V-4 from the 2010 V-Max. That would sure have a hell of a lot of growl. I know that the weight might be an issue (I haven't been able to find a dry weight on the actual engine, but at 1679 cc it's probably only slightly lighter than the water craft engine), but the V-4 configuration might allow for a different placement in the frame (or a new frame) than the inline 4. Relocating some of the weight from the front to the center of the sled might just be enough to silence the nay sayers out there -- especially if it can be done while adding 50 hp to the sled. I guess all we can do is wait and see what happens!
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Xs 2 on this speculation !!!!

 

[Ported Hornet]

I was at my dealer on saturday and the owner of the dealership expects to see an Apex replacement. In fact, he hasn't recieved the Apex GT that he ordered. He also stated that he thinks yamaha is going to redo the phazer and possible offer something a new sled in between the phazer and Nytro.

He also stated that Yamaha has made some changes in manufacturing so they call produce a lesser volume of sleds and still be profitable. He expects to see less choices in graphics and colors to keep costs down.

For the record this particular dealership has been owed by the same family since the 60's.

My .02

 

[jaydaniels]

I would expect evolutionary rather than revolutionary in Feb. FX chassis with the cast front clip of the latest sno-x sled (see pics on this site) / EPS (its coming) / super high quality shocks (maybe something new here) / 4-cylinder, 4 valve, 170 hp max / 10-15 lbs of weight saving.
Big power, turbos, superchargers and all the other fantasy stuff, not next year.

What is EPS? Just curious.

 

[legends14x]

electronic power steering. I think yami could pull that off first in a sled.

 

[MT RX1 Mountain Man]

Re: Lots of speculation...

I'm reading a lot of speculating going on here --- everything from using a newer version of the R-1 engine to using the new supercharged water craft engine. One thing that I haven't seen anyone mention is the 200 hp liquid- cooled four-stroke DOHC 65 degree V-4 from the 2010 V-Max. That would sure have a hell of a lot of growl. I know that the weight might be an issue (I haven't been able to find a dry weight on the actual engine, but at 1679 cc it's probably only slightly lighter than the water craft engine), but the V-4 configuration might allow for a different placement in the frame (or a new frame) than the inline 4. Relocating some of the weight from the front to the center of the sled might just be enough to silence the nay sayers out there -- especially if it can be done while adding 50 hp to the sled. I guess all we can do is wait and see what happens!
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Take this engine shove it back a little further in the Apex chassis, and in whatever configuration be it NA, TC, or SC get 180-200hp and drop 30-50 pounds and I think you would have a winner. Not even all of us mountain guys are really crazy about the FX chassis. I think with the V-4 and the updates done to the Nytro MTX SE would make a helluva sled. Although I don't know if you would get the torque from a V-config that you would get from an inline. An exciter based on the FX chassis with 110-120 horse and 15 wide track on the MTX would be a huge improvement too though.

 

[Doug]

They've got a couple years before I'll be buyin a new sled, but unless it weighs 500lbs or less, has at least 150hp, and a rear susp. that holds together, I'll be switching brands.

 

[birkebeiner]

[...] He also stated that he thinks yamaha is going to redo the phazer and possible offer something a new sled in between the phazer and Nytro. [...]

Yes, my guess would be a 2 cyl, 900cc (or maybe even 1000cc), 4-stroke reving 10,000 rpms and based on the successful YZ450F engine, hopefully in the FX chassis (of some sort) in short and long track configuration, weighing somewhere around 200 kg (440 lbs). A short one for sno-x and trail banging and a long one for deep powder.

Wouldn't that be something?

 

[Yamaha205]

[...] He also stated that he thinks yamaha is going to redo the phazer and possible offer something a new sled in between the phazer and Nytro. [...]

Yes, my guess would be a 2 cyl, 900cc (or maybe even 1000cc), 4-stroke reving 10,000 rpms and based on the successful YZ450F engine, hopefully in the FX chassis (of some sort) in short and long track configuration, weighing somewhere around 200 kg (440 lbs). A short one for sno-x and trail banging and a long one for deep powder.

Wouldn't that be something?

using the 450f motor would make sence after using the 250f for the phazer...it would make the sled light to shut those ppl complaining about weight being an issue (witch isnt unless your carrying it on your back. lol)
more weight = more traction = more acceleration = beat the other guy

 

[Yamaha205]

the more i think of it....maybe they are already using it in the snocross sleds..never know...they seem snapier than a regular nytro....

 

[RedRocket]

Electronic Power Steering in a sled would be great! Just think of the high speed cornering with 12" ski carbides on extra wide skis yet still have the quick light steering feel of 6" carbides for tight trails.

 

[NyTrOMaNIaC]

Whatever the engine, the whole sled must be at least 500lbs dry. Plus the engine, should be a min of 170hp, with room to expand... There is no reason why they can't build that..

isnt the apex engine based off the R1? if so the r1 is around 180hp and apex 150.. where are they getting this extra 30 horse?

the R1 motor revs at about 15000rpm if i remember right and the apex is limited to 11000rpm....the extra 30hp is lost because a clutch on a sled isnt efficient at thoses rpm's. but thats where the gear reduction comes in and makes the clutch turn slower than the motor. im hoping/guessing that they'll put the 15000rpm motor in the apex and put a bigger gear reduction but will have to wait and see. 185hp 4-stroke sled would kill the competition for years to come

Nope ! The 04-08 R1 engine redlines @ 13,750 rpms, and makes most of it's 172 hp at 13,000 rpms. There is no loss in hp on the Apex engine compared to the 04-08 R1 engine because the Apex engine isn't based on the 04-08 R1 engine to begin with (refer to my my earlier reply). The current Apex engine is based on the first gen R1 engine, not the 2nd gen, and certainly not the latest gen.

 

[V-maximum]

My uncle just purchased the new bombie 800r back country if this new sled cant spank the 800r im switching brands i hope its a high reving supercharged twin with 175 hp in an fx chassis with a decent gage cluster weighing under 450 lbs wet.

 

[Yamaha205]

to NyTrOMaNIaC

your right found it on wiki

09 R1 - 133.9 kW (179.6 hp) @ 12,500 rpm without ram air

but theres no reason why they cant put the 12500rpm motor in the apex

i wonder why they dint put it in in the apex in the first place....

 

[snowbeast]

My uncle just purchased the new bombie 800r back country if this new sled cant spank the 800r im switching brands i hope its a high reving supercharged twin with 175 hp in an fx chassis with a decent gage cluster weighing under 450 lbs wet.

If what new sled cant spank the 800r,are you talking about the current apex platform,or the newer 2011 hopeful that everone is wishing uppon,because my current apex can and does spank the doo xp800r,i know i had one.

 

[V-maximum]

The apex may be faster but thats it it wont climb,handle in side hills as well or ditch bang as well. Plus it weighs way more like it or not a inline 4 is too heavey in a snowmobile,even a three cylinder is heavy, if yamaha wants to compete and surpass the bombies they have to be atleast the same weight.
A high powered twin in the fx chassis is the only way to go.
SECOND PLACE IS THE FIRST LOOSER