Food for thought. Another collaboration?

[VX1R]

View attachment 148868
Viper with SRX pipes. I had a set of CPR’s but the factory SRX pipes were better, not as peaky and mileage was much better. IMO JUST AS FAST, with a bender can of course.
Same mega power head as VX1R

Sweet set up brother!

 

[ClutchMaster]

Sweet set up brother!

Yours is sweeter! SLP’s and you have the head stiffener! Shinny too

 

[Kenneth Rogers]

This is the motor they need to bring back. Powervalve it and up the displacement to 1000. My ‘93 has 26,000km’s and runs very strong still.

 

[ClutchMaster]

View attachment 148880

This is the motor they need to bring back. Powervalve it and up the displacement to 1000. My ‘93 has 26,000km’s and runs very strong still.

Not running too strong right now

They always run the strongest right before they “POP”

 

[Kenneth Rogers]

Not running too strong right now

They always run the strongest right before they “POP”

Just a spare. I’ve got a few of them.

 

[Joshua Smith]

I am glad I'm not alone in my feelings about bringing the triple back...if I'm getting on a buzz bomb again it will have to be a yamaha triple. I only wish I knew someone high up in the yamaha food chain to harp on them about it. even if it was a spring order only deal and they build what the sell I would be on the list. time for yamaha to take the 2stroke market back over. we can call it a yamaloution.

 

[ClutchMaster]

View attachment 148880

This is the motor they need to bring back. Powervalve it and up the displacement to 1000. My ‘93 has 26,000km’s and runs very strong still.

From “Tough Guys” who like tough sleds!

 

[Kurt J]

I would never ever go back to a two stroke triple. A modern twin, maybe. But never a triple.

 

[ClutchMaster]

I would never ever go back to a two stroke triple. A modern twin, maybe. But never a triple.

Why is that? Because triples aren’t modern?
Let me tell ya something, modern isn’t always better! “Modern” can may times mean “Garbage” or “Throw away”
Put a well mapped fuel injection system with knock protection and I’ll buy one.

Fact is the large bore twins are more inherent towards ring failures because of the larger ports. They also run more ignition timing due to the pistons larger size making it more susceptible to detonation.

I laugh at people who think just because it’s not New it must be antiquated. The late 90’s early 2000’s triples were the epitome of two stroke performance. They made the most horsepower for their size and were more reliable than the current twins.
All these advertising 165hp twin cylinder motors are BS! The old iron 800 triples, many rated under 150hp would kick the snot out of any of these newer sleds and they were heavier.
I have an old 600 formula 3 it will smoke any 600 twin made to date, I’ve raced them all.

Your a victim of marketing, having to be seen on only newer machines because it might embarrass you or reduce your self esteem?

Your statement is just that, a statement, no rhyme or reason?

 

[Kurt J]

Why is that? Because triples aren’t modern?
Let me tell ya something, modern isn’t always better! “Modern” can may times mean “Garbage” or “Throw away”
Put a well mapped fuel injection system with knock protection and I’ll buy one.

Fact is the large bore twins are more inherent towards ring failures because of the larger ports. They also run more ignition timing due to the pistons larger size making it more susceptible to detonation.

I laugh at people who think just because it’s not New it must be antiquated. The late 90’s early 2000’s triples were the epitome of two stroke performance. They made the most horsepower for their size and were more reliable than the current twins.
All these advertising 165hp twin cylinder motors are BS! The old iron 800 triples, many rated under 150hp would kick the snot out of any of these newer sleds and they were heavier.
I have an old 600 formula 3 it will smoke any 600 twin made to date, I’ve raced them all.

Your a victim of marketing, having to be seen on only newer machines because it might embarrass you or reduce your self esteem?

Your statement is just that, a statement, no rhyme or reason?

You make a lot of assumptions about my choice. Truth be told, I know a twin fits my riding much better than a triple. For starters, I'm a fast trail rider and former snocross racer. I want a compact sled with great balance, and the ability to change direction quickly. Low end power and acceleration are more valuable to me than smooth power and high top speeds.
A newer twin, like the skidoo 850, offers great fuel/oil economy and performance with a single pipe. A triple of comparable power uses three pipes, and eats fuel in comparison. Add in extra weight, and more rotating weight in the crank, and you have a sled that doesn't change direction as easily or handle rough terrain as well as twin.

I've had triples (thundercat, formula 3, xlt) and they were ok for their day, but not for the way I ride. The f-III was a good lake sled, or UP groomed trail ride. Fast, but not good handling. My F6 Snopro with stock F6 efi was just as fast but much better handling.

I couldn't care less about marketing. I buy what I like, and what works for me. Having 7 sleds, I can pick and choose a sled for what the day holds. Touring 2-up, vintage, ZR440 racer, 600 mountain cat, mod 600 snopro racers, and a Nytro which I bought on a whim to see if I liked it.

We can all have our own opinion without getting butt hurt and becoming keyboard cowboys. Mine is based on knowing what I need from a sled to enjoy my riding. In 37yrs of riding I've been able to determine that for myself. If you like triples, good for you.

 

[ClutchMaster]

You make a lot of assumptions about my choice. Truth be told, I know a twin fits my riding much better than a triple. For starters, I'm a fast trail rider and former snocross racer. I want a compact sled with great balance, and the ability to change direction quickly. Low end power and acceleration are more valuable to me than smooth power and high top speeds.
A newer twin, like the skidoo 850, offers great fuel/oil economy and performance with a single pipe. A triple of comparable power uses three pipes, and eats fuel in comparison. Add in extra weight, and more rotating weight in the crank, and you have a sled that doesn't change direction as easily or handle rough terrain as well as twin.

I've had triples (thundercat, formula 3, xlt) and they were ok for their day, but not for the way I ride. The f-III was a good lake sled, or UP groomed trail ride. Fast, but not good handling. My F6 Snopro with stock F6 efi was just as fast but much better handling.

I couldn't care less about marketing. I buy what I like, and what works for me. Having 7 sleds, I can pick and choose a sled for what the day holds. Touring 2-up, vintage, ZR440 racer, 600 mountain cat, mod 600 snopro racers, and a Nytro which I bought on a whim to see if I liked it.

We can all have our own opinion without getting butt hurt and becoming keyboard cowboys. Mine is based on knowing what I need from a sled to enjoy my riding. In 37yrs of riding I've been able to determine that for myself. If you like triples, good for you.

Firstly, trail riding IS NOT snowcross racing, big difference.
Secondly, your claim that they don’t change direction easily is BS, the are much lower center of gravity and handle extremely well compared to stand up sleds. My Formula 3 with an m-10 has excellent handling and in smooth trails destroys my 2015 turbo viper LE in the twistys.
Thirdly, I’ve actually heard the “Former snocross racer” BS before, maybe you were, maybe you weren’t, I could give 2 $hits. The last guy who claimed to be a former snocross racer my girlfriend passed on the trail, although I’ll admit she rides faster than 90% of my friends.
Last but not least, fuel consumption....smaller bore two stroke triples need less port timing than big bore Twins to make the same power. Fuel injection on a triple cylinder should in theory get better mileage than a twin with the same horsepower and displacement. Your poor fuel mileage came from poor carburetor calibration. My 780 SRX with a Tempaflow carburetor compensator gets 15 mpg, same as my buddy’s fuel injected Polaris 800. I can pull him start to finish it’s not even close.

As far as responsive throttle input, there’s nothing I’ve ever ridden yet that trumps both of my triples. So rotating weight theory is pretty much just that.... a theory. Much more important is proper clutching. I run roller secondary’s and the power is instantaneous.

I’m not butt hurt, just tired of people who make a statement and don’t back it up.
If your going to say something, explain yourself please.

I respect your opinion and your welcome to it, I just don’t agree with you that’s all.

 

[ClutchMaster]

Take a look at both of these sleds, which one do you think handles better in tight corners?
The seat height on the Formula is 8 inches lower than the viper.
I can say without a doubt there is no sled currently manufactured that corners as well as this sled.
The market is driven by what the general public buys.
So keep buying taller sleds and longer tracks....and keep going slower and slower through the corners.....pushing and tipping, pushing and tipping.......just don’t get mad when you get passed by some antiquated triple.
But Hey, you look cool anyway, all jacked up like a snowcross racer ready to hit a big double jump! Oh wait there are none on the trail

 

[74Nitro]

View attachment 148951 View attachment 148952

Take a look at both of these sleds, which one do you think handles better in tight corners?
The seat height on the Formula is 8 inches lower than the viper.
I can say without a doubt there is no sled currently manufactured that corners as well as this sled.
The market is driven by what the general public buys.
So keep buying taller sleds and longer tracks....and keep going slower and slower through the corners.....pushing and tipping, pushing and tipping.......just don’t get mad when you get passed by some antiquated triple.
But Hey, you look cool anyway, all jacked up like a snowcross racer ready to hit a big double jump! Oh wait there are none on the trail

These old sleds(including all brands that were similar in that era) got a well-deserved death sentence because they simply are not comfortable to ride.
What isn't cool is sore knees and hips from decades of 'rider lower' sleds.

 

[ClutchMaster]

These old sleds(including all brands that were similar in that era got a well-deserved death sentence because they simply are not comfortable to ride.
What isn't cool is sore knees and hips from decades of 'rider lower' sleds.

They handle extremely well, that was my point.

Maybe if your over weight and out of shape it’s a bigger issue. I have no problem putting on big miles with the M10 suspension. The stock rear skid was garbage I’ll admit that.

People talk stupid about how well the new sleds handle, they are garbage compared to the older Viper chassis.

Had a guy talking $hit this year, brand new Polaris 850 with a bar riser. I was riding my SRX and my friend was riding his 2004 600 Venom. Tight twisty trail to lake Tomahawk.
I told him if he could keep up with us I would buy him dinner, got sick of hearing how badass his new sled was. Well we both lost him after about 6 or 7 corners and he never showed up at the shamrock. Oh did I forget to mention he was probably 10 years younger than myself.

Top heavy sleds are a lot more work to ride fast. I noticed this years ago when my friends all converted over. They would be sweating like whores in church at the gas stops just trying to keep up at a casual pace.

Rail beds and wide sweeping trails, yea my new viper is big power and more comfortable, then the handling is a sacrifice I’m willing to forego.

 

[ClutchMaster]

I would never ever go back to a two stroke triple. A modern twin, maybe. But never a triple.

I’m totally opposite of this statement, here’s why.

Every big twin I’ve ever ridden vibrates horrendously in comparison to the triples.

Big twins need rebuilding more often due to the larger ports, meaning a larger surface of the rings are unsupported by cylinder walls.

The engines are taller making the sleds center of gravity higher.

They are unreliable, nobody to date has made an 800 or bigger twin that’s reliable over 7000 miles. My old 600 went 15,000 miles on the original cylinders and pistons, I changed the rings at around 10k as a maintenance precaution.

Modern Twins are blowing up like balloons at a carnival despite the the fact they have fuel injection, and knock detection. That’s just insane because most of the old triples (not the fuji’s) blew up because of lean fuel mixtures. Had they been outfitted with today’s engine management systems failures would have been few and far between.

Lastly, triple pipes sound...... In Cindy’s words..
“Orgazmic”