Stock Winder belt issues - No tuned sleds

[ROCKERDAN]

I put 1500 miles on my belt last year with stock clutching. Lots of hard acceleration runs but not too many long WOT pulls. Belt looks great. This year 250 more miles but now with big venom clutch kit and 33/35 Dalton helix and orange secondary spring. Lots of hard acceleration runs and some deep snow trail breaking. close to 1800 miles on original belt and it still looks great with no chords pulling or damaged cogs.

Joe how was yours with stock belt, and belt dust? I had a ton dust on mine....

swapped over to Ultimax to test with that now....just to compare.

 

[XP123]

Joe how was yours with stock belt, and belt dust? I had a ton dust on mine....

swapped over to Ultimax to test with that now....just to compare.

I usually wipe things down around the clutch and try to keep it clean so I don't normally notice much. I know on my 1200 the dust wasn't that noticeable but it was there for sure. The black belly pans hide a lot of dust. The problem with our Winders is the red pan shows everything. I think I notice less dust with the new clutching but the clutches run hotter now if that makes any sense. I'm sure the warmer clutches has a lot to do with the much improved back shifting and engine breaking.

 

[stevewithOCD]

I put 1500 miles on my belt last year with stock clutching. Lots of hard acceleration runs but not too many long WOT pulls. Belt looks great. This year 250 more miles but now with big venom clutch kit and 33/35 Dalton helix and orange secondary spring. Lots of hard acceleration runs and some deep snow trail breaking. close to 1800 miles on original belt and it still looks great with no chords pulling or damaged cogs.

I think i have the same kit as you. What did you run on top for speed & rpm's?

 

[race24x]

Yes the dealer checked the alignment twice and set it back to 6-2. Funny mine is white and blue and the belt dust is horrible. I will see how the stock setup works I am pretty good about warming things up, but I will make sure I am better. I don't slam on my brakes and nail the throttle I know what that does for sure. I realize they are new sleds but I have a 5 year warranty and I hate hearing belts are wear items and not covered. I shouldn' need 3 spare belts just in case up north for a long weekend of riding. I may try new spring and those glide washers if this doesn' work.

 

[XP123]

I think i have the same kit as you. What did you run on top for speed & rpm's?

I have been trying to get an exact number but with this sled when your going WOT things get crazy pretty quickly. So far on longer pulls (110 mph) on loose groomed snow it will stay pretty steady between 8750--8900 RPM. I would like to see where it would be on hard packed trail or lake but so far we have been getting lots of fresh snow. I have the complete Venom kit with HH weights, orange primary and glide washers. I also have Dalton 33/35 helix and TP orange secondary spring set at 3-3. I weigh 230 lbs in street clothes and I have 3.3 grams heel--2.6 grams center--4 grams in the tip. I like the way it shifts and downshifts. I think many problems are caused from slow downshifting in stock form. After a long run the secondary stays open too long and when you hit the throttle again the belt takes a huge hit and either breaks or gets damaged. When this happens repeatedly the belt eventually blows. This is just my opinion and not fact.

 

[STAIN]

It would be interesting for those blowing belts to disassemble their secondary and primary and run it through its travel without the spring. Check it for binding in any way.
Is the belt dust caused by the belt or the fact the clutches are not working correctly? Changing belts to get rid of dust might not be getting to the root of the issue.

 

[grubf]

A quick check on the Yamaha microfiche says that all models of Sidewinders come with the same driven clutch. They all have yellow springs and they all use the same helix. The 129s are the same as the 162s. They have thrown a one-size-fits-all clutching solution at it. So I would imagine there is going to be a better solution for each individual model.

 

[Sledroll]

I bought a demo this year, and I blew 2 belts pretty quickly until I figured out what was happening.

There is a problem in the secondary clutch and it is not closing all the way when you jam the brakes and lock up the track. The belt gets stuck in the secondary, and when you give it hard gas, the belt is half way up the primary and deep in the secondary, then it snaps.


My dealer changed the bushings in the secondary today for me, and it seems to move alot smoother now. I am 90% sure this is the fix of the problem, I will report back later tonight if i go for a ride. Its pretty cold and snow out today.

Phil I have had 1500 klms. of trouble free riding , no blown belts , and a little more belt dust than I am used to on my Apex's.
But , I had a couple instances where I locked it up going thru a corner and when I got back on the gas , it squealed and hardly moved .let off and then back on the gas and all ok.
I have done this a couple times when I blow thru turns , cause I don't realize I am going too fast .
With my limited clutching knowledge , I am guessing the secondary is the culprit .
It doesn't seam to be able to keep up to the primary.
Because I have had no issues so far , my sled is bone stock !
I have not HAD to do anything , not even carbide change on tuners .
YET !
This is going to change , might not be today (too fricken cold) , might not be tomorrow(hope to go for a ride), but there will be changes.
Waiting to catch up with RockerDan , to decide .

 

[Sledroll]

I have been trying to get an exact number but with this sled when your going WOT things get crazy pretty quickly. So far on longer pulls (110 mph) on loose groomed snow it will stay pretty steady between 8750--8900 RPM. I would like to see where it would be on hard packed trail or lake but so far we have been getting lots of fresh snow. I have the complete Venom kit with HH weights, orange primary and glide washers. I also have Dalton 33/35 helix and TP orange secondary spring set at 3-3. I weigh 230 lbs in street clothes and I have 3.3 grams heel--2.6 grams center--4 grams in the tip. I like the way it shifts and downshifts. I think many problems are caused from slow downshifting in stock form. After a long run the secondary stays open too long and when you hit the throttle again the belt takes a huge hit and either breaks or gets damaged. When this happens repeatedly the belt eventually blows. This is just my opinion and not fact.

XP123 R U planning to add a tune at some point ?
I am about the same weight as you , so your set up seems perfect for me also.

 

[1nc 2000]

Sleds built by someone else and the only difference is skis and Clutches. Do the clutch get messed with... Who knows.

Some sleds have belt issues some don't.

That's why I wanted to find my belt blowing problem before I changed clutching components.

I believe it's an issue at the cat factory.
Just saying....

 

[bleedyamaha]

It would be interesting for those blowing belts to disassemble their secondary and primary and run it through its travel without the spring. Check it for binding in any way.
Is the belt dust caused by the belt or the fact the clutches are not working correctly? Changing belts to get rid of dust might not be getting to the root of the issue.

Stain I had the 2014 Viper and that 8jp was a POS IMO. Belt dust everywhere. I am seeing the same thing. Than Yamaha Tim stumbled onto the 8dn. What a great marriage. Minimal dust and last along time. Way cheaper also. I am already experimenting with the 8dn.

 

[saskattakman]

anybody getting warranty on thier belts? I know the belts are a wear item but there has to be other issues that are causing the belts to blow? are the guys that got new secondary bushings having the problem fixed?

 

[XP123]

XP123 R U planning to add a tune at some point ?
I am about the same weight as you , so your set up seems perfect for me also.

At this point I would say no. My stock sled with my clutch set up performs really good. Tonight I grabbed a handful of throttle on a straight trail and it jumped to 9100 RPM and then settled at 8900. It hit 110 mph in what felt like a couple seconds. This sled in stock form is a beast.

 

[STAIN]

Stain I had the 2014 Viper and that 8jp was a POS IMO. Belt dust everywhere. I am seeing the same thing. Than Yamaha Tim stumbled onto the 8dn. What a great marriage. Minimal dust and last along time. Way cheaper also. I am already experimenting with the 8dn.

I had the opposite result with my 14 Viper. With Heelclicker clutching of my own set up my 8JP lasted 3000 miles with no dust or marking of the clutches. Stock motor.
I did switch to the 8DN when I turbo charged it. I have since gone back to stock and will return to the 8JP.

 

[Rtbo]

What should a person change with the clutching if they weigh 300 lbs. I have a ltx le with a TP orange tuff guy secondary spring set to 3-3 and glide washers in the primary. I blew a belt the other day running fast loose trails, belt blew from heat. My apex blew a few too on long wot runs. I like to hold them to the bar and see if I can get one of my 2 stroke buddies to blow up.